# Classifieds > Testimonials >  Bad shipping by popular seller-What would you do??

## Kelsieb

I put this here since it involves two baby pixies. I ordered one baby Giant African pixie and one baby Dwarf Tanzanian pixie. They were supposed to be shipped out next wednesday on December 11 for arrival on December 12, this was decided and confirmed during a phone call. This did not happen, I came home today at 5:30pm to find a box containing the two pixies and two cases of feeder roaches. The packing was horrible! I opened the box in a mild panic to find a heat pack sitting ON the baby giant pixie and two more heat packs free floating in the box wrapped in brown paper bags! I havent been home all day and was not informed that they would be shipping my frogs out today. I had ordered other things from them and when I got the conformation shipping email I thought it was for the cages, feeders or heat mat I ordered. I am so angry right now and will never be giving this company my business again! I did get a photo of the box after opening, I wasnt expecting the frogs so I never thought to video record and when I saw there were frogs I took them out quickly in a panic hoping they werent dead! They are both alive, but the tanzanian dwarf is sluggish which worries me greatly!

My questions now are: Should I email the company and express my displeasure? Should I take this to the faunaclassifieds BOI as a warning? This has never happened to me before so i'm unsure what to do. I included a general picture of the packing with the two cases of feeder roaches still in there and the heat packs as well as the two frogs.

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## Carlos

When there is a grievance against a company, the first step should be to contact them and discuss the issue in a calm and professional manner.  Also, although it's too late this time, all communications should be written (i.e. email) so there is a hard copy in case something goes wrong.  Taking pictures of package, noting package conditions with delivery person, etc. all help to clear a dispute.  

When live animals are involved; a picture of any dead or damaged arrivals sent to seller within one hour is crucial and usually required.  Understand from your post that you where not expecting the frogs until later; but referencing a phone conversation is not better than referencing an email.  Try and get in contact with person you talked to and see where the confusion started.  Document everything from now on and if you are not satisfied; then can write a post including your documentation here or at BOI.  Hope both frogs make it OK and good luck  :Smile:  !

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## Kelsieb

> When there is a grievance against a company, the first step should be to contact them and discuss the issue in a calm and professional manner.  Also, although it's too late this time, all communications should be written (i.e. email) so there is a hard copy in case something goes wrong.  Taking pictures of package, noting package conditions with delivery person, etc. all help to clear a dispute.  
> 
> When live animals are involved; a picture of any dead or damaged arrivals sent to seller within one hour is crucial and usually required.  Understand from your post that you where not expecting the frogs until later; but referencing a phone conversation is not better than referencing an email.  Try and get in contact with person you talked to and see where the confusion started.  Document everything from now on and if you are not satisfied; then can write a post including your documentation here or at BOI.  Hope both frogs make it OK and good luck  !


Thanks for the advice! I sent them a polite email, now I just have to wait and see if they'll bother to answer.

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## Silkmoth

How are they now? Is it ok to ask what company? I just got a new froggie, a baby pacman. The company emailed when I would like it shipped. I answered and did not get the reply with tracking. I dont trust yahoo at all! So to be on the safe side I expected him yesterday. He came! He was properly packed and warm.
I guess when in doubt if you possibly can arrange help with the delivery?

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## Tongue Flicker

If i were you i'd email them, send them the photos and get a refund or a replacement.

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## Kelsieb

The frogs arrived alive so I dont know what you mean by replacement. They seem to be okay, and I'd rather not name the company just yet although they have yet to answer the email I sent and on their website they claim they reply within 48 hours. I'm considering going to the BOI and posting an info thread, would that be acceptable or overreacting?

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## Silkmoth

I understand about not telling us who they are. I studied the bad and good sellers on faunaclassified.

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## Lynn

Hi All,
I know that it is too late regarding how these deliveries were arranged.
I hope all the frogs are doing ok and will continue to thrive and be 'happy and healthy'
So sorry for the additional stress these frogs have gone through !  :Frown: 

But for the future 

IMO the *ONLY* way to receive a new frog is via fedex
-overnight delivery- only
-have the frog shipped to 'your ' nearest'  fedex hub- NOT to your home
-you can be there in the AM and meet it when it arrives by 10 am

I would rather have my delivery in my hand then have the box bumping around in a truck> to my door. 

If the individual/business will not ship this way - I buy from someone else 

I had a frog sent to my door (once) via UPS. It went ok - but I would NEVER do it again.

_ fedex hub - only - for me_

Most often- (breeders I have purchased from- anyway ) will refuse to send their frogs any other way...but to a fedex hub 

We need to be QUITE clear when ordering regarding our delivery demands- it is imperative. 
Regarding this breeder/company that sent the frogs on the 'wrong day' -- well it's inexcusable.
They should be held completely responsible for health issues they may have caused, including the vet bill !
I suppose 'mistakes' happen - but.........this is a biggy. 
After all, they are in 'business' to move their frogs around in as safe a manner as possible.

Carlos is right! Sadly, you want everything ( re delivery plans) in an email ( with a tracking # immediately after the delivery took place) ,  so there are no ' he said, she said' after a mistake. I believe speaking to a breeder personally ,as well, is a great way to get a feel for how they take care of _their_ animals.

I am not a breeder...I do have offspring...If I were to mail them ....delivery to a fedex hub would be the ONLY way...otherwise.............well .......... they don't go ! 

 :Butterfly:

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## Carlos

Based on your 1st post information; would not open a thread at BOI.  You have no hardcopy of delayed shipment agreement; only your version of TELCON.  Also, you did not take pictures of box arrival conditions.  Your thread could easily turn back on yourself and taint your reputation in there; something you might need in the future against a different grievance.  Don't do business with them in future and enjoy your frogs and roaches.

Lynn advice is great, just make sure your animals are being sent to local FEDEX hub versus local FEDEX store.  I ordered some fish once and they got sent to a FEDEX store; which added another truck ride to them and was the equivalent of them being sent home  :EEK!:  .

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## Kelsieb

> Hi All,
> I know that it is too late regarding how these deliveries were arranged.
> I hope all the frogs are doing ok and will continue to thrive and be 'happy and healthy'
> So sorry for the additional stress these frogs have gone through ! 
> 
> But for the future 
> 
> IMO the *ONLY* way to receive a new frog is via fedex
> -overnight delivery- only
> ...


I actually didn't call them, they called me which I was not happy about. I despise talking on the phone and prefer email. I have asbergers so talking on the phone is awkward and I didn't know how to tell the lady that I only wanted to communicate through email. If anyone wants to know who the company is feel free to PM me, they advertise here a lot so I don't want to publicly out them and then have angry people emailing me. They have yet to respond to my email so I guess they are just going to pretend this never happened. The frogs seem okay, although the Tanzanian dwarf eats kinda weird.

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## MatthewM1

Personally I would at least start a review thread on this site, that's what it's for. If they are ignoring attempts to contact them that's a problem regardless of how popular the seller is. A negative review tends to grab attention. And in the event they attempt to fix the problem afterwards a positive review of how they responded can always be added. 

Sent from my LG-P930 using Tapatalk 2

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## Flying Dutchman

> I actually didn't call them, they called me which I was not happy about. I despise talking on the phone and prefer email. I have asbergers so talking on the phone is awkward and I didn't know how to tell the lady that I only wanted to communicate through email. If anyone wants to know who the company is feel free to PM me, they advertise here a lot so I don't want to publicly out them and then have angry people emailing me. They have yet to respond to my email so I guess they are just going to pretend this never happened. The frogs seem okay, although the Tanzanian dwarf eats kinda weird.


Hi there fellow Asperger! It can take some time, but I know for sure you will be able to talk to people on the phone. When I was young I never answered the phone, I still think it's kind of awkward to talk to a piece of plastic, and I'm also better in writing an email. I also have learned to speak to people, and not hidding for them. In my job as a teacher I have to talk a lot, and believe me, I'm a great talker! As an Asperger you can learn how to use your Asperger as a force, kind of like a weapon or power. It took me some years, but it was worth it. If have some great E-books about Asperger, you can always pm me about them.

On topic: About the delivery, I know how you feel. It's awfull when "normal" people mess up the schedule. The frogs are fine, don't think about it too much. Care for them (we Aspergers are good at caring for animals!) and they will be fine.

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## Kelsieb

> Personally I would at least start a review thread on this site, that's what it's for. If they are ignoring attempts to contact them that's a problem regardless of how popular the seller is. A negative review tends to grab attention. And in the event they attempt to fix the problem afterwards a positive review of how they responded can always be added. 
> 
> Sent from my LG-P930 using Tapatalk 2


I actually got an email from them apologizing so it's all good. Still wont be buying animals from them anytime soon though!

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## Kelsieb

> Hi there fellow Asperger! It can take some time, but I know for sure you will be able to talk to people on the phone. When I was young I never answered the phone, I still think it's kind of awkward to talk to a piece of plastic, and I'm also better in writing an email. I also have learned to speak to people, and not hidding for them. In my job as a teacher I have to talk a lot, and believe me, I'm a great talker! As an Asperger you can learn how to use your Asperger as a force, kind of like a weapon or power. It took me some years, but it was worth it. If have some great E-books about Asperger, you can always pm me about them.
> 
> On topic: About the delivery, I know how you feel. It's awfull when "normal" people mess up the schedule. The frogs are fine, don't think about it too much. Care for them (we Aspergers are good at caring for animals!) and they will be fine.


I hear you on messing up the schedual! When I recieved the package I assumed it was the dubia's I ordered and wasnt expecting frogs. I had a mild panic attack. Not fun.
I think I may be a little to good at caring for critters sometimes lol! My vet says that my big male, Senor, is a tad overweight  :Smile:

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## Silkmoth

I also have asperges. It makes me love to absorb info. Im a very good handspinner because of it. It helps me tune in to my mantids so I hope it will help me do well with my froggies.
It sounds good that you heard from the seller. That lousy packing may have been a one time thing. I ordered feeder maggots from a lady and they never came! Fault of the post office. Recently I ordered maggots from another business and they arrived dead! No heatpack. That may have been my fault, I cant remember if I told them one was needed. Bummer. :Frown:

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## Randy

if youre concerned this guy does this  on a regular basis try this link Report Animal Cruelty FAQ | ASPCA

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## Carlos

> if youre concerned this guy does this  on a regular basis try this link Report Animal Cruelty FAQ | ASPCA


Hi Randy  :Smile:  !  Agree 100% any cruelty is bad; but what makes you think shipping/selling animals in this case was cruel?  It's clear a miscommunication gave birth to the issues being discussed in thread.  

Last thing this hobby needs is the ASPCA deciding for us that commercial sales and shipment of live frogs is animal cruelty  :Mad:  .

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## Geo

I agree absolutely with Carlos. The pet trade is suffering from misinformation already in regard to certain areas that the general public and even the SPCA don't understand because they don't typically deal with certain species. Sometimes non-pet owners hysteria, when something tragic but very unusual happens, feeds the frenzy and when the authorities get involved they sway with public opinion rather then professional data. I have hard enough time getting my hands on hobby related stuff, if someone sets off an unexpected/unwanted red flag then uneducated decision makers clamp down and limit our access. It is unfortunate but sometimes the pet hobbies suffer because of ignorance be it bad owners or uneducated authority figures. This situation may have been simply an unusual occurrence. 

Typically most companies, especially if they have been around for some time, will do what they can to rectify the situation if given an adequate enough time to do so. Some suppliers / breeders are not large companies but mom/pop setups that want to make their customers happy but they may have a million things going on right at the moment that the occurrence was noticed and reported. Plus there is always human error and we are all humans.

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Mentat

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## Randy

If you have ever seen the  horrid conditions some  of the poor animals arrive in ( a lot of them end up dead you'd have a bit more sympathy for them. I'm not going  into detail here  but i have received dead animals where the  seller  lied straight up to me  about when they were shipped .Frozen to death or  smothered .If someones going to mass breed for  pure profit they are as bad as  those that mas breed dogs  cats etc..and should be regulated.

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## Kelsieb

> If you have ever seen the  horrid conditions some  of the poor animals arrive in ( a lot of them end up dead you'd have a bit more sympathy for them. I'm not going  into detail here  but i have received dead animals where the  seller  lied straight up to me  about when they were shipped .Frozen to death or  smothered .If someones going to mass breed for  pure profit they are as bad as  those that mas breed dogs  cats etc..and should be regulated.


I agree! Even with staff I dont understand how breeders that own hundreds of animals can possibly give them all proper care and space requirements. I can think of one big name breeder off the top of my head that keeps full grown retics in 6ft by 3ft tubs and showcases it on youtube like there's nothing wrong! How can anyone consider that humane?? I have 10 snakes and can sometimes barely keep up with who wants to come out for some roaming time to stretch their muscles. Just because they can't wine and bark like dogs somehow makes it okay to keep them in dark tubs with no hides or light? Argh! Okay, getting off my soapbox!

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## taniaaust1

Glad to hear that they appoligised and the frogs have turned out okay.  Not an animal but I had a rare plant order come to me not too long ago. It came and I wasnt expecting it due to what had been previously arranged.  So it sat outside in a heatwave for a couple of days without me knowing it had been delivered as it wasnt supposed to come and then I found it outside half dead. It ended up completely dying, I ended up not paying for it.   I have Aspergers too so really hate it when I get screwed around by a company like that.  The company previously delayed my order by a month as they were on holiday but didnt bother putting that anywhere where people ordering things could see it till the order was finalised and completed and then the message came up.


Had this been an animal and not just a rare plant, I would of been furious.






> Hi there fellow Asperger! It can take some time, but I know for sure you will be able to talk to people on the phone. When I was young I never answered the phone, I still think it's kind of awkward to talk to a piece of plastic, and I'm also better in writing an email. I also have learned to speak to people, and not hidding for them. In my job as a teacher I have to talk a lot, and believe me, I'm a great talker! As an Asperger you can learn how to use your Asperger as a force, kind of like a weapon or power. It took me some years, but it was worth it.


I have Aspergers and hate talking on phone time (I dont even like much even talking to my friends on a phone).  Ive always thou forced myself to talk on a phone when I need to do so but unfortunately in my case (Im in my 40s).. I still are no more comfortable talking on a phone then I was when I was a teen.  I still feel sick and get anxiousty whenever I need to talk to someone I do not know extremely well on a phone and still often uncomfortable talking with friends on a phone too.  I really wish it did get easier but for myself, that hasnt been the case at all.

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