# Frogs & Toads > Pacman Frogs >  Questions regaurding heating, awnsers needed as soon as possible!

## Brandon

Am i suppost to be worried about ground or air tempature with a pacman?

My tank's air tempature is about* 69.1F* which i am very worried about... Though the ground tempature is *78.1 F*. I do have foil ontop of the cage, but i don't want to fry him either.


*I really need some advice on what to do here, what to get that can help me with this problem... Currently my home base for supplies is Pet smart.
*

I would really appreciate if i could get all the help i can!

Thanks!

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## Cory

Hi, With the way the temps have been lately im not surprised your having problems. If you have a dome to put a bulb in I would suggest to buy maybe a 40 watt red bulb or night bulb to help bring the temps up. Either one would work because by the sounds of things you will need to keep it on at night. If you cant get a thermostat I would buy a dimmer from good old walmart or home depot. Or you could buy a dome with a dimmer on it.

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## Brandon

Hey, I've got a night and daylight lamp in a zoomed mini dome heat lamp. It's a double by the way. Not sure if i read it right but what i believe i have is a 50 watt bulb for daylight.. The writing was kinda worn so i'm not sure

Night is 60 watts, that brings ground up to about 80, havent checked air with it on.

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## Cory

If the ground is 80f with it on then I would throw it in, the air will be a few degrees hotter. if you can get the air to around 82 and the ground even around 78f during the day that would be better then what it is now. Then at night just dim it down a few degrees.

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RicoThePacman

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## Brandon

Ill contact you in a bit if it improves, just make sure you check for my post every once in a while, once again thanks for your awesome help.

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## Brandon

> Ill contact you in a bit if it improves, just make sure you check for my post every once in a while, once again thanks for your awesome help.


Air temp peaked around 73-74F. Your opinion on this?

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## Jason

Too low unless you're using a heat mat which will create a hot spot on the bottom

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RicoThePacman

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## Brandon

> Too low unless you're using a heat mat which will create a hot spot on the bottom


Yeah, I am using a heat mat, which isn't very big. It's a zilla heat mat, he burrows ontop of it all the time. The air temp is the weird thing.. Even with foil on the cage and like 50 watt bulbs..

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## Jason

It doesn't matter on size, all will produce the same amount of heat, accept larger mats will cover more space. You can take the foil off, there's no need for it really. Heat mats are not designed to heat the air and create more of a hot spot animals will seek out for heat. However, when it heats damp substrate some heat will go into the air. Use a digital thermometer, place the probe directly on the mat to get an accurate temperature reading, as well as a thermostat probe. My frog moved the thermostat probe the other day and the mat reached 100F. The thermometers you stick on the side of the cage will not accurately measure the temperature of the mat as they measure the ambient temperatures but you need to measure the temperature of glass underneath the substrate, where the frog will be. Although the ambient temperatures are low, the frog will burrow down to the mat to heat up. Don't use bulbs with heat mats unless the mat is on the side, as then there will be heat coming from both directions so it may confuse the frog

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## Brandon

> It doesn't matter on size, all will produce the same amount of heat, accept larger mats will cover more space. You can take the foil off, there's no need for it really. Heat mats are not designed to heat the air and create more of a hot spot animals will seek out for heat. However, when it heats damp substrate some heat will go into the air. Use a digital thermometer, place the probe directly on the mat to get an accurate temperature reading, as well as a thermostat probe. My frog moved the thermostat probe the other day and the mat reached 100F. The thermometers you stick on the side of the cage will not accurately measure the temperature of the mat as they measure the ambient temperatures but you need to measure the temperature of glass underneath the substrate, where the frog will be. Although the ambient temperatures are low, the frog will burrow down to the mat to heat up. Don't use bulbs with heat mats unless the mat is on the side, as then there will be heat coming from both directions so it may confuse the frog


I have a thermo hygrometer, and a probe, maybe since the thermo hygrometer is up against the glass, it is givving incorrect reading?

Also, regaurding the probe, you mean, inside the cage, or outside?

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## Jason

If it's not directly on the mat it will give off an inaccurate reading. Inside the cage. I have my thermostat probe and thermometer probe under the substrate, directly on top of where the mat is

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## Cory

I don't know about all matts but the zoo med UTH are made to heat the air in the tank. This is the last paragraph from there instructions manual. But I will admit that the amount of headaches you get trying to get this to work, its a lot easier to just use lights. 

* 
 

Plug Heater In:  
 
*

 
 
 
The ReptiTherm® is designed to slowly heat glass, and then the air inside of your terrarium. The heater will take a minimum of six hours before you get an accurate temperature reading in your terrarium. If your animal spends all of its time near the heater it means that there is not enough heat in the cage. Supplemental heat should be added immediately.                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                  
* 
 


 
*

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## Brandon

> If it's not directly on the mat it will give off an inaccurate reading. Inside the cage. I have my thermostat probe and thermometer probe under the substrate, directly on top of where the mat is


Ok, just buried the probe on the heat mat.

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## Brandon

> I don't know about all matts but the zoo med UTH are made to heat the air in the tank. This is the last paragraph from there instructions manual. But I will admit that the amount of headaches you get trying to get this to work, its a lot easier to just use lights. 
> 
> * 
>  
> 
> Plug Heater In:  
>  
> *
> 
> ...



What's more suitable? Side or bottom?

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## Brandon

If someone could make me a list of what I should do here, or what I should purchase that'd be wonderful. He does spend most of his time near his heat pad. I have 50 watt bulbs, everything seems to be perfectly spot on.. But what the he*l is going on?!?

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## Jason

The reason why it heats the air is because it heats the substrate, which then disperses the heat but it's only minimal. I'd imagine damp substrate will create more of an ambient air temperature. When used on the side, without anything to buffer the heat it will not heat the air but any objects near the mat, if you get me? Typically heat mats are used to create a hot spot where the animal will warm itself up. I wouldn't even listen to their instructions, as it doesn't emphasize enough in their instructions the importance of a thermostat! Habistat and pro rep are my favourite brands. I personally use it on the bottom with a thermostat and I have absolutely no problems with temperatures, as I've said heat mats can reach 100oF when unstatted but mine are always on a thermostat. They're not really amazing when used on the sides, unless you're using it for a arboreal animal that will seek it out for heat but a Horned frog won't really do that during the day, when it's in it's burrow. Heat lights work well but do tend to dry the tank, but in larger tanks a moisture gradient can be created.

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## Brandon

but my problem is it isn't heating the air. The air peaks around 74-74.5F. The substrate peaks around 81-83.4F

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## Brandon

Correct me if im wrong, the *thermostat* (corrected)* controls the wattage running to objects in order to make it warmer or cooler?

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## Jason

Exactly what I'm saying and you've proved my point, thank you! They do not work well at heating the air! However, it doesn't matter, the frog will get heated up as it burrows down and just because the air is cooler doesn't mean the ground isn't ideal. The glass will get heated up, the frog will burrow down and then get heated off the warm glass. If you place the thermometer under the substrate atop of where the mat is you'll see that it's quite warm and that's where the animal will be. The air temperature is only important when using a heat bulb.

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## Jason

A thermometer monitors the temps, a thermostat controls the heater to achieve the temps. Both are needed

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## Brandon

The only problem is, thermometers are pricey online, and there are none around me! None at petsmart, and I haven't seen a 500R around me yet..

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## Jason

Over here they are £30 but they are more commonly used here by the sounds of it. Check if you can find habistat or microclimate ones online, you don't need the fancy ones, just the on/off ones will do. You could just go with bulbs, they don't need thermostats as you can just select a higher or lower wattage to regulate the temps. If you're using a 40W the now, try a 60W. Zoo med night light red are actually quite good

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## Brandon

On petsmarts website, 500r is good you were saying?

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## Jason

Not sure on what that is, so can't say. I only use habistat and microclimate as they are cheap and great. Maybe a dimmer switch could be used?

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## Brandon

> Not sure on what that is, so can't say. I only use habistat and microclimate as they are cheap and great. Maybe a dimmer switch could be used?


Microclimates look awesome  :Frown: 

Can't get them around here. - no one sells

or online. - expensive af

Can't get a 500R either... Im gonna look around for a bit, until then, wish me luck.

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jasonm96

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## Jason

that's ****! just look for ones that aren't dimmers but ones that are on/off or pulse proportional, they're fine for heat mats and are cheaper

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