# Frogs & Toads > Fire Belly Toads (Bombina) >  URGENT! Frog sick- Fungal infection? Bacterial Infection? Ammonia?

## Lexi

My fire belly toad "toothpick" is seriously sick. A couple days ago he  came down with something and I put him in a 5 gallon isolation tank and  watched him for a few days. He got better but was still acting a little  off, but i went ahead and put him back in his main tank because my other  frog "shrek" had come down with the same thing and was in need of  isolation. Shrek made a full recovery in two days and was put back in  the main tank, but toothpick came down with it again and it was worse  this time. 

Something to know is the tank has an ammonia spike  last week due to a couple feeder reds I was expirementally housing in  the tank. The ammonia has gone down and fish removed now and the water  has been ok for about 5 days, and Toothpick got his second wind of  whatever this sickness is about a day ago. At first I thought it was the  ammonia but now it seems like something more. I know FBT can have  underlying problems that only effect them when they are weak, so maybe  the ammonia weakened him?

Thats the story, but it seems more like an infection. Here are the symptoms.
-Swollen Eyes
-Dark colored and loss of pigment
-In the water alot
-Weight Loss
-Sleeping almost all the time, slightly lethargic

He  also has some white spots on the sternum (or bone between the front  legs at the base of the throat/chest bone) I always passed it off as  scarring or something cuz it looks like little scratches that have  healed up and its only in that area. Maybe its fungus?



 I have also found that you are usually asked to fill out this form on this site about sickness so I will do that now.
*1. Size of enclosure -10 gallon tank.
2. # of inhabitants - specifically other frogs and size differences -2 other male fire belly toads, same size.
3. Humidity -Not sure but Semi high since its mostly aquatic.
4. Temperature -75 degrees Fahrenheit.
5. Water - type - for both misting and soaking dish -Tap water treated with ReptoSafe.
6. Materials used for substrate -Large rocks underwater and a HUGE rock as land side (covers 25% of the tank)
7. Enclosure set up i.e. plants (live or artificial), wood, bark and other materials. -75%  water with substrate above + a flower pot on its side and fake leaves  covering half 1/3 the water area as hides. A submersible filter behind  the pot (wish i could tell you the name and brand but i forget. Its for 5  gallon tanks) 2.5-3 inches of water in the deepest part, shallow slope up to land.
-How were things prepared prior to being put into the viv. -rocks  boiled and then tested in the vinegar to see if they were safe, pot and  fake plants rinsed heavily in hot water and let soak for about a half  hour. 
8. Main food source -Crickets about 1/3 inch. Fed 3-5 every other day in a feeding tank and monitored to ensure equal portions. Crickets are Gut loaded and fed carrots to improve color before feeding.
9. Vitamins and calcium? (how often) -Flukers Calcium Supplement+ ReptiCal vitamin supplement once a week.
10. Lighting -UVB Lighting for 12 hours a day, no lighting at night
11. What is being used to maintain the temperature of the enclosure -The room is warm. The thermometer I use usually stays around 73-75 degees water temp.
12. When is the last time he/she ate -Just now, three crickets. He surprisingly still has an appetite.
13. Have you found poop lately -I honestly never find poop, it all gets sucked up in the filter.
14. A pic would be helpful including frog and enclosure (any including cell phone pic is fine) -Shown at bottom of post.
15. Describe frog's symptoms and/or recent physical changes; to include it's ventral/belly area. -**-Swollen Eyes
-Dark colored and loss of pigment
-In the water alot
-Weight Loss
-Sleeping almost all the time, slightly lethargic
-no changes to belly area
-some white spots on chest bone/sternum. Looks like Scarring 
16. How old is the frog -unsure
17. How long have you owned him/her -Owned all three for 6 weeks.
18. Is the frog wild caught or captive bred -Pet Store bought so assumingly wild caught
19. Frog food- how often and if it is diverse, what other feeders are used as treats -Crickets? and very occassional tiny mealworms
20. How often the frog is handled -Only for a couple seconds when moved back and forth to their feeding enclosure. They are fed 3 times a week.
21. Is the enclosure kept in a high or low traffic area -Low, besides the sounds of my cat and other enclosures.
22. Describe enclosure maintenance (water changes, cleaning, etc) -100% water changes every two weeks, filtered with a submersible filter for a 5 gallon tank, rocks will be rinsed/ soaked in hot water every 4-6 months depending on when i feel they need cleaned.*

Pictures of Enclosure, the frog and its symptoms are included.

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## Carlos

Hello and welcome to FF!  Sorry your frogs are not doing well  :Frown:  .  Feeder fish are vectors for parasites and other pathogens like bacteria.  Great health risk to use with frogs.  Suggest doing 25-50% weekly water changes versus 100%.  Also; when you clean the gravel in your tank, it's killing the good bio-bacteria in it and your under gravel filter stops working until it cycles again in a month or so.  Water changes should be conducted with same temperature water.

Recommend get some Melafix and Pimafix, then treat water with both daily for one week according to label instructions.  You can prepare solution in gallon jugs or similar measuring device to try and figure out actual water volume in tank so there are no overdoses.  Good luck  :Smile:  !

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## Lexi

Thank you so much! I was aware feeder fish will sometimes pass on parasites. They were quarantined for a while before added to the mix and where in there for a week. Fortunately, neither the fish nor frogs seemed to have parasite problems-this seems more like an infection. I recently got these frogs so im still getting a feel for them. They have not had their gravel cleaned yet, and one of the 100% water changes was for the ammonia spike (which its probably more like 70-80% water change cuz i left some water in there.) 25-50% will be much easier.

I have one question though- Im sketchy on Melafix and Primafix. In some fish with labyrinth organs-like bettas- it burns them and can kill them. These are fish who breathe air as well as oxygen in the water. It cant harm my toads lungs or anything can it? lol it seems like a silly question but i just have to ask. I believe there are about 2.5 gallons in the tank, give or take.

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## Carlos

Never heard Melafix or Pimafix harmed Bettas and have used Melafix on mine with no issues  :EEK!:  .  Both meds can be used together (per the label instructions) safely with frogs  :Smile:  .

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## dj1

What is the PH of the water do you know? I ask as the large stone looks like it could be a form of limestone, and it will leach lime into the water which will make the water  very alkaline, and will irritate the skin of the toads.
Also if you have a  filter in the tank how long did it run before adding the toads? with  a  filter in the set up personally  I wouldn't stress the toads by feeding them else where

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## bill

> Never heard Melafix or Pimafix harmed Bettas and have used Melafix on mine with no issues  .  Both meds can be used together (per the label instructions) safely with frogs  .


i have never heard that either. new one on me. i have also used it with labyrinth fish as well..

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## Carlos

Melafix & Pimafix come in different concentrations that must be added according to the particular bottle label where product comes from.  Think that has led to a few aquarists overdosing aquariums and hurting their fish.  Myself use the "Professional" bottle which is 10X the concentration of regular store sold Melafix.

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