# Frogs & Toads > Dart Frogs (Dendrobatidae) > Beginner Discussion >  Best Type of Darts for a Terrestrial Tank

## megsfrogs

Hi I have a ten gallon terrestrial vivarium set up for dart frogs. I am trying to decide what species to get. I heard that Dendrobates leucomelas are great for beginners but they like to climb more then other species. I am now looking into Dendrobates tinctorious 'Inferalanis'. I know a ten gallon is smaller and I plan on moving up to a larger tank in a year or so, but was hoping to find a species that does well in smaller terrestrial enclosures (for beginner dart frog owners). Any suggestions on what species?

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## Lynn

Hello,
A ten gallon is small to permanently house 2 tincs or 2 leucomelas. It's not horrible... but they would appreciate more space.
After adding the drainage and soil - litte height is left- maybe only 7 "

If you can convert it to a vertical , 2 leucs  would have/use more living space than the tincs would if left terrestrial.
Try to get or build some kind of ledge they can climb to. 

If left terrestrial consider only  2 tincs or  2 auratus. Once you learn about them/ observe their behavior; you will see that the additional space will be appreciated. 

This enclosure will not go to waste as you can always use it for a quarantine tank. Be sure the lid is secure and 99% glass to maintain the proper humidity level.

If you should decide on D auratus---( like for all dart frogs species) be very careful with the temps...as they are much less tolerable of an accidental climb in the temp. D auratus are not as bold as leucs --their 'personalities' are completely different. 

A thumbnail species such as 2 R imitator "varadero" would be ok for this tank if it were converted to a vertical.
They spend most of their time up high in vines that should be provided.
BUT--- be extremely careful when opening an enclosure of a converted aquarium for a thumbnail species. 
They are fast and very proficient at escaping w/out your even knowing it !!!  :Frown: 

When you're  able:
an 18" x 18 " cube....ie exo terra is ok for a pair of tincs.( they are best housed in sexed pairs )   
This is a minimum enclosures size for them. 
The background/ plants/ deco should be minimal so not to take up a lot of their space. 
Plus they need a hides... ie larger leaf litter ( magnolia leaves) and a coconut hut coververing a glass petri dish.  

An 18" x 18" x 24"H  for a trio or trio of leucs ...ie exo terra ( leucs are ok in a group if given space )

You will read about D leucomelas and D auratus being good group frogs. They are, specially the auratus.
However, they still need space to get out of each other's way. 

example:
I keep 5 leucs ( 2 females and 3 males) ( breeding ) in a 18"x 36 wide x 24H exo terra. They use every inch of this enclosure and enjoy climbing. 
This enclosure is large enough not to have to remove the breeders. It's terraced --> leading additional to "vertical " floor space and hides.
I have a vine growing across the top , an inch from the ceiling glass they will often climb to and hang out. They are clumsy climbers ... but don't tell them that!  There are 4 huts in this enclosure and numerous place to get 'some peace and quiet"  if they need to retreat. 

Hope this helps 
BTW - Welcome to Frog Forum 
 :Butterfly:

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## megsfrogs

Thank you so much for the advice Lynn. Sounds like converting my tank to a vert or getting a larger tank would be a good idea for the future. Thanks for a tank ideas and what different species prefer. Sounds like even though many species care sheets say they are terrestrial they still climb and would like the space. Thanks for the help.

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## Lynn

You're welcome  :Smile: 

Some thoughts while enjoying my morning coffee  :Smile:  

When you are first starting out, like with any hobby, it's important to research every step.
-know the answer to every 'beginner' question ...such as fruits flies, temps, humidity, mixing species ( toxins) , level of difficulty, morphs, locales, hybridizing, proper quarantine, identification of illness, proper supplementation....the list is huge   :Big Grin: 

( I wish we had a "_Dart Frogs  for Dummies_" )

Where to buy ! Know who you are buying from :
ASK ! 
The individual from which one is purchasing a dart frog( s)  should know and willing share the following information:
-species and care needs
-be especially carefully w/ the purchase of froglets that reproduce readily and/or may be allowed to produce larger and/or frequent clutches.
-age !! 
- where did the 'parents' of the frogs come from
- are they siblings, different clutch mates ( from same parents)   
- what were they being fed.. ie brand of supplements 
-how were they being housed ( alone or w/clutch mates ) in QT set up or planted 
-be sure they look alert 
-the transport container should NOT be dry or look like its been used a thousand times
-If at a show ----- look carefully at the overall 'care' of the animals being sold.
-beware of 'made- up' morph names

If you are purchasing a "froglet" or juvenile, be aware of what size they should be. 
They should be at least 3 months old.
I have seen Dendrobates juveniles at shows that are 1/2 !!! the size of froglets their same age. Beware! 

On the other side of the coin, those of us who breed frogs run into issues as well.
I have had some, really, awful questions from _potential_ buyers.
This typically occurs with the purchase of more reasonably priced frogs --such as leucs.
-can this frog live in a shoebox
-"mommy can I get one"  
-what does it eat
-do I have to feed it fruit flies
I have turned buyers away ! I remember a 'potential buyer telling me  "you can't do that".
Ha !   :Big Grin:  guess what ! After months of care from eggs to tads to the care oow for 3 months.... a breeder can,
and should do whatever they determine is best for the frogs.
They should be completely comfortable turning  a buyer down. 
With no disrespect---buyers purchasing a 35$ frog(s)  are typically have less experience than those purchasing frogs that are 150$ each.

A breeder has the responsibility of managing the offspring of their breeders so there is never the SAD situation of having to "get rid of" all the offspring.

These frogs are precious and need to be protected in captivity as well as in their wild habitat.

 :Butterfly:

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## megsfrogs

Thanks so much Lynn. The information about what questions to ask breeders is great. I am going to a show next month and want to buy directly from breeders, the show only allows captive bred animals to be sold. I will narrow down the type of tincs or auratus before than and see what they have. I will make sure to ask all those questions you talked about. Thanks for the great buying advice. I am in no hurry to purchase and want to take my time and find the right frog for me and have nice healthy frogs.

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## Lynn

Good luck 'mgegsfrogs' How exciting!!!!  BTW...Is your name Meg? 
Have you built the enclosure(s) ( purchased the supplies for it )  , practiced and/or made fruit fly cultures, purchased a QT tank, and purchased springtails?

Please let us know if you need any help in preparing things for when you bring the frog(s )home? 

A great enclosure: 
http://www.amazon.com/Exo-Terra-Glas.../dp/B000OQYGQ4

great supplies : 
http://www.neherpetoculture.com/vivariumbasekits 

flies:
http://www.neherpetoculture.com/bugs

Great springtails:
http://www.joshsfrogs.com/temperate-...ure-32-oz.html

wonderful plants:
http://www.neherpetoculture.com/plantpacks

Have fun !
 :Butterfly:

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## Lynn

Good luck 'mgegsfrogs' How exciting!!!!  BTW...Is your name Meg? 
Have you built the enclosure(s) ( purchased the supplies for it )  , practiced and/or made fruit fly cultures, purchased a QT tank, and purchased springtails?

Please let us know if you need any help in preparing things for when you bring the frog(s )home? 

A great enclosure: 
http://www.amazon.com/Exo-Terra-Glas.../dp/B000OQYGQ4

great supplies : 
http://www.neherpetoculture.com/vivariumbasekits 

flies:
http://www.neherpetoculture.com/bugs

Great springtails:
http://www.joshsfrogs.com/temperate-...ure-32-oz.html

wonderful plants:
http://www.neherpetoculture.com/plantpacks

Have fun !
 :Butterfly:

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## megsfrogs

Tank is planted and seeded with Springtails, from new england herpstoculture llc. My fruit fly culture kit is in the mail (joshs frogs), I have cultured fruit flies before as I was a biology major at university. I have 2 QT tanks. I just need to get the cultures going and I should be set. I have also been working with the lighting/temp/humidity in my tank and its been no lower then 67 at night and no hotter then 75 during the day, humidity is pretty constant at 97-99. Besides letting the plants grow in more and get the fruit flies going I feel mostly set up. By the way my name is Megan thanks for asking. Also what do you think about Reptifoggers I use one in my Whites Tree Frog tank and like it. As my house gets warmer during the summer it could help with cooling? Thoughts?

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