# Frogs & Toads > Mantella & Other Mantellidae > Gallery for Mantellidae >  Mantellas

## birdsflybackwards

Mantella aurantiaca


different line of aurantiaca


future viv, planted this week



Mantella ebenaui

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## John Clare

Very good photos, thank you for sharing.  What species and how many do you have?

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## birdsflybackwards

Currently I keep

0.0.6 Mantella aurantiaca
2.2.1 Mantella crocea
2.3.2 Mantella ebenaui
2.0 Mantella pulchra (getting a female soon)
3.2 Mantella viridis

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## Kurt

Very cool.

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## John Clare

> Currently I keep
> 
> 0.0.6 Mantella aurantiaca
> 2.2.1 Mantella crocea
> 2.3.2 Mantella ebenaui
> 2.0 Mantella pulchra (getting a female soon)
> 3.2 Mantella viridis


That's quite a Mantella collection.  Have you had much success breeding them to date?

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## birdsflybackwards

> That's quite a Mantella collection.  Have you had much success breeding them to date?


Currently I have about 25 Mantella crocea tads in the water.  The crocea group is still young but produced three clutches since I received them in June. The first two clutches were bad but the third one had a good amount of fertile eggs.

The viridis I have had for a year, they laid two bad clutches last year but have not done anything since. The ebenaui I got last year turned out to be all females, so I got 4 unsexed ebenaui at the end of July. The group was introduced about a month ago and there has been a lot of calling and one of the females looks to be gravid, so we'll see.

YouTube - Mantella crocea tads

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## John Clare

I'm in awe.  Particularly since you're still so young  :Wink:  and have accomplished things most of us will never.  Thank you for the video.  I am curious about the tadpoles - just how big are they and how large are they before metamorphosis?

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## John Clare

Actually, what colour are your adults?

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## Tom

Very impressive.

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## birdsflybackwards

> I'm in awe.  Particularly since you're still so young  and have accomplished things most of us will never.  Thank you for the video.  I am curious about the tadpoles - just how big are they and how large are they before metamorphosis?


Right now they are somewhere in between Gosner stages 27 and 33 (there's a lot of variation within the group) so according to Mantellas by Mark Staniszewski they are less than 25 mm in length. I'm guessing the average in this group is about 20mm based on this information.  I'm not sure how big they will be when they metamorphose out, but Milotynpanum is the smallest known species of Mantella and they morph out around 4mm, while viridis morph out around 12mm.  Crocea are closer in size to milotympanum so if I had to guess I'd say 6-9mm if we assume that tads morph out proportional to their adult size.  

The adults are F1's from Devins frogs so they look pretty much identical to the pictures on Mantella Frogs.  I'll try to get a decent pic of mine soon, because their flashmarks are pretty impressive for CB frogs.

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## John Clare

Again, very informative, thank you Emily.  I am impressed with your photography too - it's not easy to photograph these small, active frogs - I speak from experience  :Wink: .

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## John Clare

Actually, one more question for you - what is the grey layer above the LECA in your planted vivarium photo?

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## Mike

> Actually, one more question for you - what is the grey layer above the LECA in your planted vivarium photo?


sodium bentonite

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## birdsflybackwards

> Actually, one more question for you - what is the grey layer above the LECA in your planted vivarium photo?


The substrate is a mix of flourite, leaf litter, peat, coco husk, and sphagnum.  I think the grey you are seeing is the condensation from the drainage layer that I couldn't reach when I wiped the glass down to take the photo. 

The background is sodium bentonite, but it doesn't really look grey because its mixed in with peat, flourite,and LECA dust.

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## John Clare

Thanks for answering that.  Have you sculpted the sodium bentonite?  How did you do that and what kind of paint did you use?

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## birdsflybackwards

> Thanks for answering that.  Have you sculpted the sodium bentonite?  How did you do that and what kind of paint did you use?


Sodium bentonite is the clay used in kitty litter, it is also used to line koi ponds and legally fill oil wells...it also makes your skin better...

I got mine from a koi store and its the brand Benseal (Baroid Benseal). You can mix in just about any natural medium you want and and as long as there is still 1/3 bentonite (this is as low a ratio as I have gone, very possible you could go lower) it will still stick to the glass.  There was no paint involved, my goal was to have as natural a vivarium as possible so I didn't use any GS, silicone, paint ect.  The background of this tank was about 1/3 sodium bentonite, 1/3 peat, and 1/3 flourite, with a small amount of leca dust added for color.

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## John Clare

Thanks for that walk through.  I have learned so much from you already - thank you for being so open and helpful  :Smile: .

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## Tom

Is it easy to shape?

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## Stemcellular

Nice pics Em.

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## Nick Boudin

Great Pictures, love mantellas more and more recently!

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## birdsflybackwards

> Is it easy to shape?


Yes, it's clay and it's wet so you can mold it into just about any shape you want.  

and thanks Ray and Nick!

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## Tom

Do you have to cure it in any special way?

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## birdsflybackwards

> Do you have to cure it in any special way?


Nope, I often add plants right after the hardscape is done and on a few occasions the frogs have been added on the same day.

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## Tom

Oh that is great I am kinda sick of the doing GS backgrounds.

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## John Clare

How heavy is that tank with just the background in it?  And when it's full, can you move it without risk of it breaking?

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## John Clare

And here's another one for you - what exactly is fluorite and where do you get it?

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## birdsflybackwards

> How heavy is that tank with just the background in it?  And when it's full, can you move it without risk of it breaking?


This tank is a 15 gallon, and I could lift it without having to worry about dropping it.  The bentonite itself seems to be heavier than GS since its denser, but if you're just creating a background without wood or rocks a thin layer does not add much weight.  Its the landscaping and extra clay used to secure hard things in place which adds the most mass. 




> And here's another one for you - what exactly is fluorite and where do you get it?


Flourite is a clay "gravel" traditionally used in aquariums in replacement or in combination with stones, sand, peat ect. This is the first time I have used it so I can't personally say much about it, but I have read that plants grow well in it.

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## John Clare

Thanks again.

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## Tom

Wait where do you get it?

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## birdsflybackwards

> Wait where do you get it?


I got mine at a local pet store but you can get it online if you can't find it locally.

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## John Clare

Emily, I'm a newbie to this background business and I've spent the last day doing some research.  I've read conflicting things about bentonite.  People say it will crack if it dries out.  Is this true?  Do you have to worry about it cracking?  Any info you have to offer would be greatly appreciated.

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## birdsflybackwards

> Emily, I'm a newbie to this background business and I've spent the last day doing some research.  I've read conflicting things about bentonite.  People say it will crack if it dries out.  Is this true?  Do you have to worry about it cracking?  Any info you have to offer would be greatly appreciated.


If you have not already read these threads, there is some good information and pics in them

the deal with calcium bentonite - Dendroboard
Bentonite clay/ kitty litter - Dendroboard
Bentonite clay - Dendroboard

I once left out some bentonite for a month or so, it was extra I did not use in a tank, and later when I found it it was rock hard and inmalleable.  Originally it was mixed with water but since it was not in an enclosed space, the water had evaporated out and binded the mix together.  I added water to see if it could be used again, but it stayed hard and sharp.  

Depending on what kind of tank you set up this could be a good or bad thing, if its for a more temperate species or a desert species you could mold a background and then let it dry out and you would get a rough textured surface.  I'm not sure how well it would hold up long term, the dried out clay I had cracked but did not loose its shape at all.  In a tropical enclosed vivarium you don't have to worry about it cracking.  Even if its not super humid, when you first make the mix it gets saturated and it takes a while for the moisture to leave the clay, even when not in a viv.  If you are worried about it cracking, misting it regularly would most likely prevent this from happening.   Currently I have 5 tanks with bentonite backgrounds, and I have not had problems with any of them.

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## John Clare

Thanks Emily, yes I had already read those threads.

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## RRFROGS

Hey, very nice viv u got there. what kinds of plants do u have in there?

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## CrazyAirborne

i want to see more pics of that background! ive only done a couple vivs but im already sick of silicone!

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## daggekko

hey, i have used flourite in aquariums in the past. tips for all...rinse rinse rinse rinse rinse...i put it in a 42 gallon hex tank and filled it with water after a quick rinse, 3 days later i could finally see the back of the tank. 

PLANTS GROW AWESOME in it!!!...i never got into CO2 with planted aquariums but was very happy with the results of using flourite. 

i think caribsea might make it. i know petsmart used to carry it in their gravel section but other fish stores should carry it

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## birdsflybackwards

> Hey, very nice viv u got there. what kinds of plants do u have in there?


Aeschynanthus, peperomia, xootrophian, bulbophyllum, crypteris, and some noids.

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