# Frogs & Toads > Aquatic Clawed Frogs >  African Dwarf Frog questions! Please help!

## Deku

Hello. As I used to have african CLAWED frogs years ago. Now Iam wanting to get into african DWARF frogs. Yes, I still have my toads(they're taught to hand feed--all of em--) and they are doing great. My parents made our basement into a space for fishtanks and terrariums. Currently my tanks are down there, but my friend gave me a 29g recently as a gift. My parents let me accept it, and now they let me set it up in my room. But since we want to avoid dirt in my room(due to the rugs). Id like to start an aquarium. I was thinking of having a little bit of everything. Id like to get your opinions guys. Would african DWARF frogs be happy in this tank? Iam planning on getting 6-7 of em. Those arent the only inhabitants. Iam thinking of getting 2 snails(apple), 5-6small shrimps(cherry shrimps preferably), and 7-9small 1inch schooling fish. I was thinking id go for either mosquito fish(gambusia), guppies, mountain clouds, or some other type of minnow. And no not all together. Just this:
A small group of frogs
A pair of snails
A small group of shrimp
A small group of fish. 

I have the filters to back it up. :P I got my fluval 305 cleaned up and all. I have this fluval heater, that measures the EXACT water temperature and distributes it accordingly. If it gets a degree above the water temp in my room, the heater either goes in low power or doesnt heat. :P You get it? Iam planing on using fake plants, black tahitan moon sand, and some live plants and maybe an ornament or two. The black sand is my favorite and I already have it either way(he gave it to me). I have a hood already, but it has a uv light(not a super bright one), but it distributes enough uvb to keep a turtle happy(old turtle light-long story). I have airiators ment for like 100gallons. I have extra filters in case one of em screws up. 

My question is, will this set up work? Frogs, fish, snails and shrimp?  

As for foods, what foods should I feed ADF? I have frozen foods(brine shrimp, bloodworms, clam). I have reptomin meant for aquatic turtles and frogs. Would this be good? its fortified in calcium and vitamins. Later on Iam thinking of buying frozen daphnia, frozen krill and frozen mysis shrimp. 

Please help. Iam trying to get educated on em.

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## Geoff

> My question is, will this set up work? Frogs, fish, snails and shrimp?


The answer to your question is: probably. The fact is that there can never be a blueprint that guarantees success and if you're mixing different animals in the same tank there is always the potential for unforseen problems and complications. For example, competition for food.




> As for foods, what foods should I feed ADF? I have frozen foods(brine shrimp, bloodworms, clam). I have reptomin meant for aquatic turtles and frogs. Would this be good? its fortified in calcium and vitamins. Later on Iam thinking of buying frozen daphnia, frozen krill and frozen mysis shrimp. 
> 
> Please help. Iam trying to get educated on em.


Frozen brine shrimp and bloodworms are fine in my experience and I've bred them when those two frozen foods have formed their staple diet. I cannot comment on the other frozen foods you've mentioned as I've never used them. Live foods like tubifex, Daphnia and white mosquito larvae are the ideal. Not only are they more nutritious but the frogs' hunting behaviour, which is sometimes cat-like, is very engaging to observe.

_Hymenochirus_ frogs are very under-rated in my opinion and often regarded as smaller versions of _Xenopus_ but their behaviour is much more complex and all the more interesting for that. Their behaviour is largely affected by the conditions under which they are kept and a dedicated tank is best to observe it fully.

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## Deku

> The answer to your question is: probably. The fact is that there can never be a blueprint that guarantees success and if you're mixing different animals in the same tank there is always the potential for unforseen problems and complications. For example, competition for food.
> 
> 
> 
> Frozen brine shrimp and bloodworms are fine in my experience and I've bred them when those two frozen foods have formed their staple diet. I cannot comment on the other frozen foods you've mentioned as I've never used them. Live foods like tubifex, Daphnia and white mosquito larvae are the ideal. Not only are they more nutritious but the frogs' hunting behaviour, which is sometimes cat-like, is very engaging to observe.
> 
> _Hymenochirus_ frogs are very under-rated in my opinion and often regarded as smaller versions of _Xenopus_ but their behaviour is much more complex and all the more interesting for that. Their behaviour is largely affected by the conditions under which they are kept and a dedicated tank is best to observe it fully.


Hmm thanks. Ived been thinking about what id do with the tank. I like having single species tank, but I wanted a community tank of some sort. I was thinking of like a group of frogs, a group of cherry shrimps, one betta, and a group of black or white colored guppies(the betta will attack any bright colored fish, esp. reds, blues, and yellows---in my experience that is) and maybe one or two otto cats(for clean up). Ived seen people put in their dwarfs with bettas and they do superb because the bettas do not eat much thus do not pose any competition for the frogs. The shrimps are scavengers and are not soo fast that will pose a competition for foods. The otto cats mainly eat algea and left overs(they are nocturnal). I found some sites that said I should feed hbh pellets and I think it was zoo meds pellet??? Iam thinking of feeding pellets meant for newts. Or maybe ill go to xenopus express and buy their pellets but in baby pellets. :P I do plan on feeding frozen foods. but i dont want to feed it "Daily". I dont know if I can culture daphnea(water fleas), brine shrimp(sea monkeys---may not be a problem), blood worms(how the heck would I even do that???). I could also offer them live earth worms(chopped). Could I feed by tongs?

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## Geoff

There's little I can add to my last post.  If you want a communtity tank with frogs in it and you feel reasonably confident that it'll work then try it but I've never kept the frogs with such diverse tank mates.

You say that the shrimps are scavengers and the cats eat left overs. The frogs are bottom feeders so the question that arises in my mind is how you can ensure everything gets enough to eat even if you try using tongs. Also, getting the portion of food right without running the risk of polluting the water could  be a problem.

When I mentioned live food I wasn't thinking in terms of you culturing them but buying them from a tropical fish store. However, if you're interested in going down that route you probably know that this site's sister site has forums devoted to live food culture at: Advanced Newt & Salamander Topics - Food: Live, Frozen, Freeze-Dried, Pellets, etc at Caudata.org Newt and Salamander Portal

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## Jen

with african DWARF frogs, I really prefer having them as the only bottom dweller - - giving how hard it is to feed them anyways - it gets exponentially harder in a community tank...and even _harder_ in a community tank with other bottom dwellers. 

I would keep the adf as your only bottom dweller and stock lightly with fish - -make a large shoal of one type of tetra for appearances

that is just my opinion - i feel this may be the best solution for all the tankmates involved

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## Tony

> with african DWARF frogs, I really prefer having them as the only bottom dweller - - giving how hard it is to feed them anyways - it gets exponentially harder in a community tank...and even _harder_ in a community tank with other bottom dwellers.


I completely agree with this. Although I no longer keep them I have in the past both in community and single species tanks. Feeding was always a problem in the community tank, even though none of the fish were bottom dwellers they had no trouble making a trip down to snatch up the frog food.

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## passon13

I have an adf, 1 angelfish, 3 platies, 1 Cory and a bock khuli loach and they do fine together. I feed my adf sinking shrimp pellets, though I have never seen him eat I'm assuming he eats them, as he's still Alive

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## Jen

going by the method of - if its living it must be getting enough is not the right way of thinking.   you want to make sure your frog is well cared for and not just "Getting by" on scraps it manages to find after the fish.

for it to thrive and not simply survive...it needs dedicated feeding by a dedicated owner

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## Deku

> going by the method of - if its living it must be getting enough is not the right way of thinking.   you want to make sure your frog is well cared for and not just "Getting by" on scraps it manages to find after the fish.
> 
> for it to thrive and not simply survive...it needs dedicated feeding by a dedicated owner


Agreed. Personally angelfish are one of my favorite fishes(fav. fish include: goldfish, angelfish(fresh, and salt), puffers, oscars, true catfish, piranhas, eels, and buenos aires tetras, oh and gambusias) but I wou ldnt even add em with an african dwarf frog. Because I know for a fact that angel fish may look graceful but angels are fairly aggressive(They are a cichlid after all). Just because it may be doing well at this present time, doesnt mean the angel will never throw a fit and devour them whole. Ived seen angels attack other fish. Also angels have very specific needs to thrive in a tank. They need a C02 diffuser, they need a high temp of 82, soft and acidic water. They need the tank to be fully planted, need to be in sexed pairs, and many other complicated stuff. Just because the fish is alive, doesnt mean its at its prime. Its why I was carefully  thinking what would be able to be mixed and what not could. Ived been going to many online fish forums just to figure out what will go with an african dwarf frog. Guppies can do well with or without a bit of salt in their tanks(they prefer some salt though), african frogs(claweds and dwarfs) can both tolerate to an extent of salinity. Both like hard alkaline waters. Guppies are gregarious, and peacefull and nature ALTHOUGH they may chase around other fish(for fun) but wont harm them physically. They live up to 2-3 years around so, breed like rabbits(provides a snack for the dwarfs) and are fairly clean and pretty to look at. African dwarfs, are also pretty clean to keep(that is if you're doing the right job). Shrimps are bottom dweallers, but they dont pose any threat. Bettas are known to get along with the dwarves(ived seen it with my eyes, multiple times). 

But I still wanted to make sure that its an okay idea.

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## 1buscemi

Hello everyone, I have an issue and I would like to know what you all think.  I have 2 African Dwarf Frogs and they are currently in a 2 gallon tank.  From the research I have done, the water is supposed to be at least 70 degrees.  I know for a fact the water they are in now is not that warm.  What do I do?? :Frog Surprise:  Do I need to buy a tank water heater?? :Frog Surprise: 

Please help, it is visible that they are cold, they wont move at all and they will not eat.  They haven't eaten in almost 2 weeks, I don't think its the food because they have eaten it previously.

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## 1buscemi

is it ok to use a submersible water heater with ADF's??  is it dangerous to have the heater in the tank with the frogs??? can the frogs get hurt from it (i.e die)?

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## Jen

Heaters are absolutely fine and you should buy one immediately.

You should also up grade to a 5+ gallon..
this helps keep the water more stable.
their temp should also be slightly higher than 70* to keep them healthy.


Do you filter the tank?
How often do you change the water?
Do you treat the water before adding it?
What are you feeding them and how often?

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## Jen

Just want to verify ....does your frog has webbing between the fingers on their front hands and back feet or just webbing on the back feet?

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## 1buscemi

Thank you so much for responding.  There is webbing on all of the feet.  The tank is freshwater tank so I only change the water and clean the tank 1x/mo.  When I got them they were in a much smaller tank with only a rock and a plant.  They were very cramped that's why I upgraded to0 the tank I have now.  The tank did not come with a filter so I am not using one now.  The water is fresh so there is no treating it.  When I got them they gave me food pellets.  They didn't like them so I got them bloodworms and they liked them for a while, now they won't eat at all!!  :Mad:

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## 1buscemi

they kind of just stay either at the bottom of the tank or under their plant. I dont even see them come up to breathe anymore...

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## Jen

> Thank you so much for responding.  There is webbing on all of the feet.  The tank is freshwater tank so I only change the water and clean the tank 1x/mo.  When I got them they were in a much smaller tank with only a rock and a plant.  They were very cramped that's why I upgraded to0 the tank I have now.  The tank did not come with a filter so I am not using one now.  The water is fresh so there is no treating it.  When I got them they gave me food pellets.  They didn't like them so I got them bloodworms and they liked them for a while, now they won't eat at all!!




ok here are a few problems :

with no filter and such a small tank - changing the water only once a month means you are leaving them in high levels of ammonia (frog waste) for a LONG period of time and this is very very bad for them!

for a small tank like yours, with out a filter, you should be either doing a daily small water change or a 100% water change every 5-7 days. (Think - fresh water animals liked "FRESH" water  :Smile:  )
 Once a month is no where near sufficient.   Ammonia literally burns their skin and will eventually cause Red leg - an fatal disease caused by poor water quality.
you should also be treating your water - yes even "fresh water" because tap water has chemicals in it.  you need a dechlorinator at the very least.   



Food - - bloodworms should be fed only as a treat (once a week or so)
As soon as possible - pick up either HBH frog and tadpole bites or Reptomin sticks (these float and need to be broken up for the frog to eat)



*In summary - - change their diet, clean their water more frequently,  treat their water, get a heater and consider an upgrade.*

Larger quantities of water are more stable which helps prevent illness.

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## Jen

In all honesty, I am not 100% these frogs will make it.   Unfortunately when you purchased them, you were not told how to properly care for them (Something the pet stores are known for being neglectful about)

You bought them in a new gimmick item - a tiny "habitat" which is about 2-3 cups of water at best.   

With a heater, better water quality, and a more nutritional diet you may see a HUGE improvement in them.

If unfortunately the changes have come too late, I would not be discouraged from keeping them again.  You are on the right track now to learning how to properly keep them and if the changes are made you will know that you have done all you can do

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## 1buscemi

thank you so much!! this really helps.   they were fine for a long time, and then they just came to a halt.  I am definitely going to make these changes.   Thank you again :-)

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## Jen

no problem!!! I hope your little guys pull through!!! Please keep me updated  :Smile:

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## 1buscemi

well now I am going out now to get the right products.

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## 1buscemi

oh i definitely will :-)

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## Jen

don't forget the dechlorinator  :Wink:

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## 1buscemi

...i know the pet store sells these small dechlorinating shells, they're small and white, and they just sit on the tank floor.  is this what you are referring to?

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## Jen

not at all...its a liquid.

ask any employee - they will know what dechlorinator is.   

You can also pick up Stress coat to help them out since they are a bit under the weather.   But definitely get some dechlorinator

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## 1buscemi

oh boy am I glad I met you..lol...I would have gotten the wrong things for them, or I probably would have let them be...

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## Jen

:Big Grin: 

No worries. You seem like you have the heart of a great frog owner!   When you get back start a new post just for your frogs so we can track their progress in their own little thread

(pictures would be helpful too so we can see if there are any signs of disease starting)

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## Jen

1buscemi - - any update on your adfs?

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## 1buscemi

hey, I am having trouble finding a heater for plastic tanks.

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## Jen

That falls in line with you really needing to upgrade. A 5 gallon glass tank is all you would need.  But as it is winter you desperately need to get those frogs in warmer water if you want them to have any chance at all of surviving

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## Deku

> oh boy am I glad I met you..lol...I would have gotten the wrong things for them, or I probably would have let them be...


 You do realise that its one african dwarf frog per 2.5 gallons? So you NEED to upgrade that tank to atleast a 5gallon. Here is a good site for your questions. I have another one. But this fellow member made it simple to understand.
http://thefrogfarm.yolasite.com/adf-faq.php

search through here.

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## FrogFarm

Okay, first thing is first, the set up you have in mind with snails, shrimp, frogs, and multiple fish could work. However, the snails aren't the best idea for a number of reasons. If they are  small enough for the frogs to eat them they can kill/hurt the frogs who  don't know any better. If they are too large the frog can get a limb  caught inside them, this happened to one of Jenstes' ACF (Louie) and she  got lucky with it but it could have been much worse. Fish are great, but if the fish are too small, the frogs might eat them. This isn't good for the ADFs as many fish have enzymes in them that are harmful to the frogs. The shrimp they barely notice for the most part, but won't harm the frogs even if eaten. So if you want a small schooling fish that won't get gobbled, maybe go for full-grown guppies (too big for an ADF to eat) or something of that sort.

The betta would probably work (instead of the school fish, of course) as they normally do well with ADF. I have a male betta in with my adult ADF and they're quite interactive with each other but not in a bad way. However, the betta did hunt down the shrimp and eat them.  :Frown: 

As for food, frozen blood worms/brine shrimp are the way to go in my opinion. Much easier than feeding live (unless you want to farm your own feed) and just as nutritional. I like the fact that the betta and frogs are on pretty much the same diet, too. It makes feeding time alot easier. 

Other bottom feeders, as someone mentioned, aren't the best tank-mates for ADF as there can be food competition. BUT if you choose to go with an algae-eater of some sort you don't have to worry about this as they aren't interested in the frogs' food and vise-versa. 

Anyways sorry for going on and on, I just thought I would give my thoughts on the matter.  :Embarrassment: 


Deku, I agree with you on the 2 gallon tank matter, buscemi1 definately needs an upgrade but I think he/she knows this now.  :Smile:

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## Deku

> Okay, first thing is first, the set up you have in mind with snails, shrimp, frogs, and multiple fish could work. However, the snails aren't the best idea for a number of reasons. If they are small enough for the frogs to eat them they can kill/hurt the frogs who don't know any better. If they are too large the frog can get a limb caught inside them, this happened to one of Jenstes' ACF (Louie) and she got lucky with it but it could have been much worse. Fish are great, but if the fish are too small, the frogs might eat them. This isn't good for the ADFs as many fish have enzymes in them that are harmful to the frogs. The shrimp they barely notice for the most part, but won't harm the frogs even if eaten. So if you want a small schooling fish that won't get gobbled, maybe go for full-grown guppies (too big for an ADF to eat) or something of that sort.
> 
> The betta would probably work (instead of the school fish, of course) as they normally do well with ADF. I have a male betta in with my adult ADF and they're quite interactive with each other but not in a bad way. However, the betta did hunt down the shrimp and eat them. 
> 
> As for food, frozen blood worms/brine shrimp are the way to go in my opinion. Much easier than feeding live (unless you want to farm your own feed) and just as nutritional. I like the fact that the betta and frogs are on pretty much the same diet, too. It makes feeding time alot easier. 
> 
> Other bottom feeders, as someone mentioned, aren't the best tank-mates for ADF as there can be food competition. BUT if you choose to go with an algae-eater of some sort you don't have to worry about this as they aren't interested in the frogs' food and vise-versa. 
> 
> Anyways sorry for going on and on, I just thought I would give my thoughts on the matter. 
> ...


 Lol'd I didn't read the whole thread. Cause someone else posted a ton of questions on my thread. I have low attention span so I only read the first few questions the made, and a few replies. But I didn't see anyone reply to them about the tank size. Obviously that tank is too small.  I personally think he/she should have a 12gallon or so and get 5frogs. Because adf are kinda community frogs. They always do better in groups. I remember seeing htem where I used to work at. the one that was alone, just sat there the whole day. While there was a 40breeder with like 20frogs or so. They were constantly active. I remember the guy said he wasnt in with the other frogs because he was brought in as a return. So he didn't want to take a chance.

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## FrogFarm

Oh yes you're definitely right about that!

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## Deku

> Oh yes you're definitely right about that!


 I decided a while ago that I may set up a tank just for african dwarf frogs, and like 20small fish like danios. I like danios. And this tank would be a 40breeder. Lol id get like 13frogs or so. and 20small danios and 10shrimps. lol

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## FrogFarm

That sounds good to me.

However, I would go with a larger species (like Giant Danios) as you don't want your frogs eating them. They have a lot of trouble digesting full-grown fish.

Other than that it sounds good to me.

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## Deku

> That sounds good to me.
> 
> However, I would go with a larger species (like Giant Danios) as you don't want your frogs eating them. They have a lot of trouble digesting full-grown fish.
> 
> Other than that it sounds good to me.


 i thought danios were too fast for em?

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## FrogFarm

Many say so, but one of my frogs got a tetra which are quite quick.
I wouldn't worry all that  much in a larger tank though, just something to consider.

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## Deku

> Many say so, but one of my frogs got a tetra which are quite quick.
> I wouldn't worry all that much in a larger tank though, just something to consider.


 Okay lol. I wonder if I can feed the frogs baby roaches too? Iam thinking of getting a few pet roaches(don't ask why-lol). Iam thinking of madagascan hissing roaches or the giant burrowing roaches. I will most likely go with the second one IF Iam able to locate them. Id get like 2-3 to start with. And id wait for them to get preggerz. When the babies come out Iam wondering If I can use some to be fed to turtles, ADF, and toads?

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## FrogFarm

I don't think that ADF could eat the baby roaches.
I think they'd be too rough to digest, you know?
My friend breeds madascar hissing cockroaches (at least I think she still does, haven't been to her place in a while) and the babies are look pretty "tough" in terms of a meal. For a turtle I would say definitely, but for ADF I wouldn't recommend it, and I don't know all that much about toads at all so...  :Stick Out Tongue:

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