# Frogs & Toads > Dart Frogs (Dendrobatidae) >  40x18x19 P.terribilis build.

## Skelly98

So... i like terribilis. So much so that i've decided to build them a giant terrarium. I'm going to follow the same general layout plan as my D.Azureus, and i have all of the essential components already (terrarium, stand, hood, thermostat, etc) and all i need now is dirt and plants and a light bulb.  I'm also going to an expo on sunday, so i think i may get the frogs for QT then. I've not said anything about this on the forums yet as i had to test all of the equipment to make sure it works, but now that i know it does.. Well, i'm building a nice, nice terrarium setup. Will be chronicling as i go.

EDIT: also. I was just reading about using gravel as substrate.. Anyone ever done this?

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## Carlos

Congrats on your new build  :Big Applause:  .  Other than using gravel as a false bottom filler (not the best due to weight) or as substrate in a wet area; would think it will make for a poor plant substrate in the dry areas  :EEK!:  .

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## Skelly98

I see. I read about it being used, but I still think I like the natural stuff better. Anyone know a good, cheap mix to use? Also, here is the terrarium.

EDIT: never mind about the great stuff photo, broke the can's injector thing by accident. Anyone know a good type of glass compatible great stuff?

Mitch.

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## bill

By glass compatible, do you mean one that will adhere to glass? Because they all will. You can cover the glass with silicone first if you like. It will give a bit more adhesion, but it's not really necessary. 


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## Skelly98

Ohh I see. I kept reading "this might not stick " on some forums... What kinds are safe? Are there any dangerous ones? Thanks, 

Mitch

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## bill

The only one I question is the fireproof version. I'm sure there are some fire retardants in there that aren't too healthy if they were to leech out. 
Personally, I prefer the ge foam. Walmart sells it for about $3/can. I find it cures with smaller air bubbles, making it easier to carve and doesn't leave big holes when doing so. 


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## Skelly98

Thanks! So Walmart ge foam? What does ge mean? Thanks, 

Mitch.

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## bill

General Electric 


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## Lynn

my 2 cents about gavel.
I have 3 pdf ( exo terra ) enclosures w gravel ( aquarium type  stuff or may be called turtle pebbles)
and 3 with hydroton ( clay ) brand unknown 

I prefer the gravel  ( heavy though ! )
1- I think the plants do better
2- it's cheaper

I would not us the hydro again.

I also use a layer of 3/4"  polyester quilt batting ( fabric store) over the gravel then the fiberglass screening ( not fabric)

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deranged chipmunk

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## Skelly98

Heading out later today to get some supplies. On the list is: Mesh, egg crate, glass for a top, and dirt. Plants and hides will be put in after. I've decided not to do a background, but instead to put sticks along the back and plant climbing vines and other arboreal plants on them, along with mabye some tillandsia and broms glued on.

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## Amy

> Heading out later today to get some supplies. On the list is: Mesh, egg crate, glass for a top, and dirt. Plants and hides will be put in after. I've decided not to do a background, but instead to put sticks along the back and plant climbing vines and other arboreal plants on them, along with mabye some tillandsia and broms glued on.


That will look awesome!  I have one viv where I used silicone to attach green reptile carpet to the back wall and the attached some small branches and broms to it, and planted a few bamboo plants along it.  The broms have since died and need replacing, but it looks really nice.

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## Skelly98

Put an order in for the glass. Not able to find some egg crate that meets my standards, so i'm going to Macgyver something instead. At the hardware store, they also have these giant bricks of coconut coir (about enough to fill the entire terrarium), so i'm going to get some and mix it in with some peat, bark, charcoal, etc. I'm going to go leaf hunting after it stops raining. The frog's qt enclosure is all ready to go.

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## Skelly98

Alright, finally some action. Got the glass today, and the substrate mixed. what did i use as a drainage layer? Well, i cut up some plastic containers and used those. Stable for the most part, also used some reinforcements in the areas where the containers couldn't quite cover. Light as a feather. Now on my shopping list: Frogs, plants, lightbulb.

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## Skelly98

So here is the setup so far. ignore the sharpie on the glass, i did it because the glass was hard to see and i needed a visual barrier so i didn't bump into it  :Stick Out Tongue: 

Also.. the stickers have been removed from the containers without residue.

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## bill

I write on my tanks all the time for visual reference. Makes life so much easier. 

Out of curiosity, did you remember to leave yourself a way to drain excess water out of the false bottom?


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## Skelly98

Yes i did, i would never forget that after having to deal with the mess in my first tank- i am going to use the same method as the first tank, and this is allowing a tube to go down into the drainage layer, start the siphon, seal the valve, and then let it go whenever i need to remove water. I will be opening the front of the tank to access the tube, but other than that it'll be fine, i think... I didn't like the idea of drilling the glass, so i went with this instead. 

Now for the plants... Anyone got some suggestions for good epiphytic plants to use? i think i might even be able to fit one of those giant, colorful broms from the hardware store.. lol, anyone got a good resource (or any knowledge to share) about growing broms and tillandsias and orchids and stuff epiphytically? 

Thanks for sticking around, 

Mitch.

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## bill

Cool! The most common error for most people is forgetting a drainage tube.  :Smile: 

What would you like to know about epiphytes? I don't keep broms or tillandsias (hate them both lol) but I do keep a few species of orchids and numerous epiphytes. 


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## Skelly98

Namely, if i wanted to attach one on a piece of wood or a stick, how would i go about doing that? I have read about using hot glue, but would that not burn the plants? and how would the plant grow without access to fertilizer or nutrients from the soil? is there anything i have to do to make them grow, or do i just glue them onto a piece of wood and leave them? And with orchids, how would I put them on if the roots are bent to the shape of a pot that they come in?

Thanks for the help,

Mitch.

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## bill

Hot glue won't burn the plants, it doesn't get hot enough. You can also use plastic wire ties, fishing line, super glue, or cotton sewing thread. I'm sure I missed a few, but I'm sure you get the gist. 

You can actually fertilize them with a diluted aquatic plant fertilizer, like flourish by seachem. Personally, I prefer the florin line of products, but they are all rather comparable. 

With orchids, just mount them using some rehydrated long fiber sphagnum. The roots will adjust. If they are too thick to adjust, you just need to be creative and maybe find a spot they will lay out easier. Choose wisely when it comes to orchids. Not all like the conditions of a dart tank. They are many that prefer less humidity, so keep that in the back of your head when selecting them. 



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## Skelly98

I see.. thanks! One (or two) last question(s).. how does one go about fertilising a plant in a terrarium? Do you just pour the dilute fertiliser over it? Or do you inject it? Or do you wet the moss with it? Is there any chance that using it too much could hurt the frogs? 

Thanks,

Mitch.

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## bill

Nah, nothing as elaborate as injecting them. Just follow the manufacturers directions by half in a spray mister. With some, that may be difficult to do because the dosage is sometimes something like 1 drop per 50 gallons or so. Just use 1 drop if that's the case. Unless you REALLY overdose, you won't harm the frogs. Admittedly, I have overdosed once or twice, and never had any ill effects to my frogs. 

If you are running something like a mistking, where you have a water reserve, you can just does the bucket. 

I actually keep 2 misters. One with ferts and one without. I only fertilize once per week. Fertilizing every day could lead to an algae condition in the tank. 


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## Skelly98

Thank you so much for all the help. Going to the expo tomorrow to get the plants and the frogs (the viv isn't finished yet, but the quarantine is), and i'm honestly really excited. 

Thanks again, 

Mitch.

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## bill

No problem  :Smile: 


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## Skelly98

Frogs number one and two... my new terribs. You can see their viv in the background, which i added leaves to, which i also got at the expo. In qt for a while... viv in a bit. Now to get some plants.... anyone know a good place to order from in canada? Thanks,

Mitch.

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## Skelly98

Also at the expo, I got these: springs and isos. Anyone know a good culturing method? Can they be cultured together? Thanks, 

Mitch.

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## Skelly98

Once again, Tapatalk isn't letting me upload pics.. Anyways, they are dwarf white isos, and some kind of small white springtail..

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## Paul

Looking good Mitchell! I culture my Springs and Isos in the same bin. I have a large container I filled halfway with ABG mix (the soil was wetted pretty heavily). Add some cardboard for the Isos. I mist them once every other day and feed with Bakers Yeast and zucchini (sliced).

The Springs will out produce the Isos but the Isos will do good in there. 


I also have a small shoebox that has charcoal in it with 1 inch of water in the bottom. This one has only Springs in it. I use this tub to pull from to restock the tanks and pull from the bigger one to resupply this one in the event I over pull from it.

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## Skelly98

That's what i did, now. I mixed both cultures into a big tub with some coconut fibre and fish flakes, and it seems to be working so far. 

Thanks,

Mitch.

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