# Frogs & Toads > Dart Frogs (Dendrobatidae) >  Mold???

## ukfan1976

Thank goodness I took the advice of some seasoned dart keepers!  I set up my terrarium, added plants and logs, moss, etc.  Looks great!  This was 2 nites ago.  I did not add the frog yet, taking the advice of some other members of this forum to let the terrarium cycle, see how it does, etc.  

Today I get up and turn on my plant light and found this white, stringy moldy?? looking stuff on the logs I added.   It was only on the logs.  Admittedly I did not wash them off before I added them to the terrarium (I dunno why!).  Anyways, now I have this white stringy stuff on the logs, looks like fine white hair, or that polyfill stuff that quilters use.  I immediately removed the logs and rinsed under hot water.  I'm including a pic.  Anyone have any idea what it is??  have I ruined my terrarium??   :Frown:  :Frown:  :Frown:

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## Paul

White mold in a new terrarium is common and is natural. It will run its course and go away in a few days. Cork bark gets this white mold very quickly when it is first introduced into a humid environment. One thing you can do is add some Springtails to the terrarium. Them LOVE to eat mold and will help keep the tank clean. On top of eating mold they LOVE to eat frog poop and decaying leaf litter or plat leaves. Eating all that waste in turns makes the soil healthier for your plants and will make your soil last longer.

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## ukfan1976

Oh thank goodness I thought I had introduced disease LOL  where would you suggest getting springtails?

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## Paul

There are a couple of good online shops. I like to get mine from here. They have cheaper shipping rate on live insect and they come in a modified ABG mix so you can just dump it straight into your tank under the moss. After a couple weeks the population will boom and you will have all the Springtails you will ever need. If it will be a while before you add frogs to the tank (2 - 4 weeks) than I would add the "Springtail food" to your order from NEHerp. It is just brewers yeast. You put a small pinch in the terrarium and lightly mist it. The yeast will mol dover night and the Springtails will flock to it and eat the mold. Just add more yeast every couple days or when you see all the previous yeast is gone. 

If you are getting a Dart frog for this tank than the Darts will snack on the springtails from time to time  :Smile: .

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## ukfan1976

> There are a couple of good online shops. I like to get mine from here. They have cheaper shipping rate on live insect and they come in a modified ABG mix so you can just dump it straight into your tank under the moss. After a couple weeks the population will boom and you will have all the Springtails you will ever need. If it will be a while before you add frogs to the tank (2 - 4 weeks) than I would add the "Springtail food" to your order from NEHerp. It is just brewers yeast. You put a small pinch in the terrarium and lightly mist it. The yeast will mol dover night and the Springtails will flock to it and eat the mold. Just add more yeast every couple days or when you see all the previous yeast is gone. 
> 
> If you are getting a Dart frog for this tank than the Darts will snack on the springtails from time to time .



Great info!  Exactly the site I was looking for! My frog is kinda tiny right now.  Would I need to add more food to the soil for the springtails until he's big enough to start pooping enough to feed them?  I'm also considering getting him a friend for the tank but want to wait til he's big enough that I can try and sex him (I really have no idea if its a "him" i just refer to him that way haha).  The tank is definitely big enough.

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## Paul

The issue I see with waiting till he is bigger is he may be to big to add a friend in there with him, smaller frogs can look like food. 

Once the frog is in the tank I would stop putting the yeast in. I don't know that it would harm the frog, but I would just in case. If you have leaf litter in the tank the leaves will start to break down and the Springtails will feed on those as well as any parts of the soil that start to break down. Any feeder insects that die in the tank will be eaten by the springtails as well. Basically once the frog is in (2 weeks or so after the springtails are added) the tank will be primed to support the springtails on it's own. 

I love NEHerp and Josh's Frogs. NEHerp has become my favorite for terrarium supplies and such. I find Josh's shipping prices to be much more expensive. Jessica at NEHerp is an absolute pleasure to deal with and is very quick to respond to emails. I have even placed an order and then contacted Jessica to tell her how I was planning to use the pieces I ordered and she did her best to pick the perfect items for me. 

I added a Springtail culture to my Red eye tree frog tank and they is a **** ton in there now. I have even pulled some springs from that tank to seed 2 other tanks. Breeding them is simple too. Buy 2 cultures and a breeding kit from NEHERP. Dump one culture into the tank and follow their instructions on setting up the breeding box. In about a month you will have plenty of springtails to start other breeding cultures or restock your terrarium to help keep the population up enough so the frog or frogs can find them easily and eat them  :Smile: . It is actually pretty cool to watch the Springtails do their thing in the tank  :Smile:

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## ukfan1976

do the springtails prefer damper soil?  or does it need to be completely dry?  what about isopods?  do they like the same soil?

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## Paul

They like high humidity which requires damp soil. Both Springtails and Isopods do good in a wide variety of soil types. ABG mix tends to be the best because it has so many different comp nets to it and will break down slower. ABG mix when cared for properly can last for over a year before it need to be replaced. 

Isopods do the same job that Springtails do and can be eaten by the frogs as well, though most frogs prefer to eat the baby isopods as they have a softer shell. Having both Springtails and Isopods will not cause harm to one or the other. Having them both in the terrarium helps in bring as much of nature as possible into the habitat. 

I know it is in another thread here, but refresh me on the frog you are putting in here. I think it was a Dart frog, they require high humidity which will lead to the soil being moist but not swampy which will be perfect for the soil insects. 

From your picture in the first post I don't see any leaf litter. Your frog will love leaf litter. It gives them loads of hiding spots if they get spooked. It will lead to your frog being more bold than it otherwise might not be. NEHERP has leaf liter as well. Its cheap and you will get more than you need. Save what you don't use to add in after a month or 2 and to replaces the leaves that have decayed.

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## ukfan1976

> They like high humidity which requires damp soil. Both Springtails and Isopods do good in a wide variety of soil types. ABG mix tends to be the best because it has so many different comp nets to it and will break down slower. ABG mix when cared for properly can last for over a year before it need to be replaced. 
> 
> Isopods do the same job that Springtails do and can be eaten by the frogs as well, though most frogs prefer to eat the baby isopods as they have a softer shell. Having both Springtails and Isopods will not cause harm to one or the other. Having them both in the terrarium helps in bring as much of nature as possible into the habitat. 
> 
> I know it is in another thread here, but refresh me on the frog you are putting in here. I think it was a Dart frog, they require high humidity which will lead to the soil being moist but not swampy which will be perfect for the soil insects. 
> 
> From your picture in the first post I don't see any leaf litter. Your frog will love leaf litter. It gives them loads of hiding spots if they get spooked. It will lead to your frog being more bold than it otherwise might not be. NEHERP has leaf liter as well. Its cheap and you will get more than you need. Save what you don't use to add in after a month or 2 and to replaces the leaves that have decayed.


I have a dart frog, Azureus.  he's still really tiny, bought him off a guy who got him this past December.  He has a big appetite and is quite active.  I'm housing him in his old terrarium which has the old substrate and a bromeliad in it right now.  He's pretty content.  I've been considering leaf litter.  I've been trying to make the terrarium as close to a forest as I can and think it will add to the ambience nicely.  I really like the NEHerp website.  does the fact i live in California  make a difference for the shipping of live insects?  

Also, something I've been wondering about is how much do I need to feed my frog?  I've been feeding once a day and just pouring some fruit flies from my culture into the tank.  I'm not real sure how many to put in there.  I'd estimate my frog is about the size of the tip of my thumb.  He's definitely a little guy.

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## Lynn

Paul has you covered !  :Smile: 
He's right --- the best thing would be springs and isopods ---lots! 
Seed both tanks!
Perhaps there is a show you could go to?
It would save those darn 'live' shipping costs.

FF
I use the 'leftovers' as a guide to _how many flies_.
Put in- at least 20 - or more- a day. If there are a lot left over ..then you can cut back  :Smile:   as long as you are sure he is not haveing trouble finding his FFs.
If he has had difficulty 'growing' it may mean he was taken from a 'grow out' enclosure too soon? Feed him well. 
Put the FF in the same spot every day. You could bury a tiny pc of banana at the FF site to keep the flies around the area. 

I feed all my adults PDFs ( fruit flies) daily - following routine: 
-dusted daily
-alternated Repcal Ca, Repashy, and RepCal Vitamins 
-the adults get Repashy Vit A once a month

however, lots of people don't feed darts daily- I like to. What difference does it make ? ...as long as there are not too many FF in the enclosure -stressing the frogs. Knowing they are eating well and getting their supplements is all that matters  :Smile: 

Now and then, I might skip a feed --- so the frogs can _clean-up_ !

-the ,very,very, newly morphed froglets get springtails and isopods 
( kept in little 2.5 gallon tanks/ dampened paper towel, a sprig of real plant and leaf litter) 
-new springs are added daily
-the older froglets get fed FF 2X daily - dusted once , spring, and isopods

I feed isopods green zucchini and springs bakers yeast- both are kept - very successfully- in the same container with wet ABG, leaf litter, and big chunks of charcoal. I keep 3 large cultures---One is used only to replenish/ add to the other 2; these '2' are used to feed the babies. Works for me.  :Smile: 

Enjoy your build.  :Butterfly:

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## ukfan1976

> Paul has you covered ! 
> He's right --- the best thing would be springs and isopods ---lots! 
> Seed both tanks!
> Perhaps there is a show you could go to?
> It would save those darn 'live' shipping costs.
> 
> FF
> I use the 'leftovers' as a guide to _how many flies_.
> Put in- at least 20 - or more- a day. If there are a lot left over ..then you can cut back   as long as you are sure he is not haveing trouble finding his FFs.
> ...



BIG Thanks to everyone!!

It looks like there is a LLL Reptile here in San Diego.  I've got most of my supplies from Pet Kingdom but not sure if they have the isopods or springtails.  One of them surely has them haha  I"ll be sure to check today when they open  :Smile:

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## Paul

I bought my last round of Mantellas from LLL and 2 of my Red Eyed tree frogs from them  :Smile:  Wish I lived close enough to a store like that.

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## ukfan1976

> I bought my last round of Mantellas from LLL and 2 of my Red Eyed tree frogs from them  Wish I lived close enough to a store like that.


Paul,

Yeah it appears the store is like 10 mins from me haha.  Don't open for a few more hours tho.  I checked out their FB page for the local store and apparently they have 20% off their Dart Frogs ending today..... LOL I may come home with more than just isopods and springtails haha.

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## Paul

LoL, send us pics if you get some! My son ordered 2 Azureus they should be here on Tuesday  :Smile:

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## ukfan1976

> LoL, send us pics if you get some! My son ordered 2 Azureus they should be here on Tuesday


Haha will do.  Kindof an addicting hobby thats for sure.

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## Paul

Yeah it is. I bought my wife 2 frogs for an early christmas present and now we have 10 frogs in the house with 2 more on the way. I am already planning the next tank and the frogs that will go into it lol.

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## ukfan1976

HAHA  yeah i have my old Terrarium and been looking at the Leucomela's and if they are reasonable at LLL i may end up with a new Azureus and some of the Leucomela's too haha.  How long do you quarantine new frogs?  I"ve read like 30 days.  Also,  my new terrarium is 24" wide, 18" deep, and 18" tall.  Do you have any idea where to get a stand for it?  I'm using a Walmart TV stand which actually looks nice but it says it only supports 50lbs and i KNOW the terrarium with soil, stone, water, etc weighs at least 80.  I live in an apt here so don't have the tools to actually build one.  suggestions?  i've done a search online and Exo Terra sells them but they are kinda pricey.

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## bill

LLL is an awesome company. Loren and the gang really know their stuff and actually give a krap about the animals they offer. They are the only people I buy frogs from on the net.  :Smile:

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## Paul

> HAHA  yeah i have my old Terrarium and been looking at the Leucomela's and if they are reasonable at LLL i may end up with a new Azureus and some of the Leucomela's too haha.  How long do you quarantine new frogs?  I"ve read like 30 days.  Also,  my new terrarium is 24" wide, 18" deep, and 18" tall.  Do you have any idea where to get a stand for it?  I'm using a Walmart TV stand which actually looks nice but it says it only supports 50lbs and i KNOW the terrarium with soil, stone, water, etc weighs at least 80.  I live in an apt here so don't have the tools to actually build one.  suggestions?  i've done a search online and Exo Terra sells them but they are kinda pricey.


If you aren't build one than in my opinion the only way to go is to do a poor mans stand. Cinder blocks and Plywood. The pre made stands you can buy at wal-mart or pet stores are grossly over priced. If you have a Sams Club near by they have some small wire selves there that are fairly cheap and can hold a tank and has wheels to you can move it around if needed.

For my last 2 tanks I bought Cinder blocks and some MDF from Home Depot. The one for my 40Gallon Breeder cost about $16 and I had Home Depot cut the MDF down to size for free in the store. I then had them cut the scraps from the MDF to the size of the cinder blocks so I could put those pieces between the cinder blocks and the floor of my house.


Quarantining them for a minimum of 30days is standard. It is also a good time to let the tank grown in and get some soil janitor insects seeded and breeding in the tank  :Smile: . Just you a small tank or a small plastic tub. I put some pothos clippings in a small pot filled with Sphagnum moss and then use 2 paper towels for the substrate. I lay the paper towels fly and soak them in de chlorinated tap water. Put a small water bowl in ( I use the lids from Peanut butter jars lol). Clean out the poop every day and change the paper towels daily to every other day. Super simple  :Smile: 

If you use a plastic tub get an old fork and hit the prongs up with a lighter and then melt holes in the lid to add ventilation to the tub. With a dart frog you won't need much since you will be opening the tub daily to feed and clean.

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## ukfan1976

> If you aren't build one than in my opinion the only way to go is to do a poor mans stand. Cinder blocks and Plywood. The pre made stands you can buy at wal-mart or pet stores are grossly over priced. If you have a Sams Club near by they have some small wire selves there that are fairly cheap and can hold a tank and has wheels to you can move it around if needed.
> 
> For my last 2 tanks I bought Cinder blocks and some MDF from Home Depot. The one for my 40Gallon Breeder cost about $16 and I had Home Depot cut the MDF down to size for free in the store. I then had them cut the scraps from the MDF to the size of the cinder blocks so I could put those pieces between the cinder blocks and the floor of my house.
> 
> 
> Quarantining them for a minimum of 30days is standard. It is also a good time to let the tank grown in and get some soil janitor insects seeded and breeding in the tank . Just you a small tank or a small plastic tub. I put some pothos clippings in a small pot filled with Sphagnum moss and then use 2 paper towels for the substrate. I lay the paper towels fly and soak them in de chlorinated tap water. Put a small water bowl in ( I use the lids from Peanut butter jars lol). Clean out the poop every day and change the paper towels daily to every other day. Super simple 
> 
> If you use a plastic tub get an old fork and hit the prongs up with a lighter and then melt holes in the lid to add ventilation to the tub. With a dart frog you won't need much since you will be opening the tub daily to feed and clean.


More good advice  :Smile: 

I went to LLL today and bought some springtails and had to talk myself out of adding a whole family of Azureus' lol  I still may go back this evening before they close and take one more look lol.  gotta nap first tho, dang night shift screwing with my sleep!  

I sure like those Mint terribilis too but I'd rather just stick with one tank right now and I know its not a good idea to mix species.  I may convert my old terrarium into one for some mints  :Smile:   They sure are cute.  

Wow 30 day quarantine, eh?  definitely makes sense.  Could I use my old terrarium that my current frog is in now (after I move my current frog to his new tank)?  or would it require me to sterilize the old tank before adding the new frogs?  

Sorry I'm such a noob, I've got some great advice here!

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## bill

I agree with Paul, while not pretty, cinder blocks are the best and cheapest stand out there. 

As far as using the old tank, sterilizing should be done. You would just be inviting a cross contamination nightmare to happen.  :Frown:

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## ukfan1976

> I agree with Paul, while not pretty, cinder blocks are the best and cheapest stand out there. 
> 
> As far as using the old tank, sterilizing should be done. You would just be inviting a cross contamination nightmare to happen.


Ok thats cool.  So in the meantime just a regular plastic shoebox-like container with some bedding and pool of water should be ok for quarantine?  for 30 days?  seems pretty long

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## bill

Yup. Unbleached, unprinted paper towels, a small water bowl and some air holes and you're good.  :Smile: 

30 days seems like it's a long time, but they will be in their new home for a long time, what's 30 days? Better to be safe than sorry. Oh and don't forget to keep the humidity up in their quarantine tank. You can even throw a cutting of a hardy plant like pothos for them to hang out in and around.

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## Paul

Yeah I use Pothos in my Quarantine bins. I use the mesh pots commonly used in terrarium back ground and stuff a bunch of Sphagnum moss in it to secure the plant. The moss also doubles as a great humidity tool since it can hold a ridiculous amount of water, and an added bonus the Pothos LOVE being planted like that! My quarantine pothos are doing better than the ones on the window seal lol. 

30 days will fly by. It will be hard once the tank is ready to roll, but just keep telling yourself... This will give me time to dial the tank in. This will help me identify any issue with the tank setup and correct. This will help me learn how to tweak the settings in my tank to simulate seasons. This will help me identify the eating habits of my frogs.

As I have said I have 3 Red eye tree frogs in quarantine right now. 2 of them have been in their quarantine setup for nearly 60 days now. The other one just finished his first week. I left the first 2 in longer they got just a little bit bigger, but at the 32 day mark I did move them into the same quarantine tub.

I am glad I have been able to be even a little helpful in your process. I am thoroughly addicted to this hobby... Heck I don't even consider it a hobby any more. This is something I will be doing for the rest of my life.

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## kev48584

I just want to be clear on this lol so when you have cork bark for example in a tank and it gets those white mold spots/patches you're suppose to leave it alone and it'll go away in a couple of days and it's normal in humid environment?? i know it's a silly question but i everytime i see that in my tarantula tanks i always remove it and discard the cork bark lol......

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## bill

> I just want to be clear on this lol so when you have cork bark for example in a tank and it gets those white mold spots/patches you're suppose to leave it alone and it'll go away in a couple of days and it's normal in humid environment?? i know it's a silly question but i everytime i see that in my tarantula tanks i always remove it and discard the cork bark lol......


That is correct. The white mold will go away on it's own. May take a few days, may take a couple weeks, but it will go away. Isopods will eat it, if your t's don't eat them first lol

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