# General Topics > Vivarium, Terrarium & Enclosure Discussion >  DIY Fake Wood...the cheap way!

## Johnny O. Farnen

Interesting how boredom, necessity, and a die grinder can result in fabulous things. :Wink: 

Here is the truth. I only use real wood in terrestrial enclosures.
However, living where I live, suitable wood that meets my needs is hard to get.

I needed tree branch like wood with many holes and hides in it. I am also a cheapskate, so I try not to buy the fancy stuff at the pet shops if I can help it.

Anyway, here is what you get with a few scraps of Schedule 80 PVC pipe, a bit of work with a die grinder (or a Dremel tool works too) and a torch (or heat gun). USe carbide steel tips on the grinder.

Cut the pipe to the length you want with a saw. Use the saw to make any large holes or jagged ends.

Texture the pipe with the grinder. If you use a 1/4 inch carbide steel ball tip, you can also make holes and such. Do not use grinding stones- they just clog up and do not work. (you can texture before or after bending, it is up to you)

Heat the pipe at the points you want to bend until it is soft, then bend it into position. Cool it it quickly at the bend with compressed air or a bucket of water.

Once sculpted, this wood is waterproof, rot proof, easy to clean, paintable, and it does not float. It is suitable for both aquatic and terrestrial use. 

I know of some Gray Tree Frogs that moved into this stuff about an hour after it was added to their enclosure. :Wink: 

Here is what you get. this is 2 inch diameter sched 80 PVC. It is not painted yet, as I have not settled on a color scheme.

----------


## John Clare

Johnny, if you make this stuff and put it up here I am sure a bunch of us would buy it.  I definitely would.  I'd be particularly interested in shorter but wider pieces.

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

That's is easy to do. Schedule 80 PVC comes in diameters from 3/8 of an inch all the way up to 12 inches and lengths of up to 20 feet. One note though, the larger the diameter the harder it is to get good bends. 

However, I think I have come up with a way to solve this problem. I have to test my theory tonight on my lunch break. :Wink:

----------


## John Clare

Looks like you have a viable side business in the making.

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

The wheels in my head are turning...

Even crazier, I just discovered I can get the pipe in diameters all the way up to 24 inches!

 With that range of sizes , heck, one could make a whole dead tree!

I am going to have to crunch some numbers here. Time is the hard part at the moment. However, the long boring winter will be here soon...

----------


## into

That was an awesome Idea! I never would have guessed those to be PVC pipes.  I use PVC pipes for my WTF but with no modification... it looks like he has plumbing in his home  :Big Grin:   I'm floored.

----------


## into

what kind of paints would be safe to use?

----------


## John Clare

Johnny, in the mean time would you take commissions?

----------


## Kurt

Thats simply incredible! You could make a living building enclosures for zoos. I was thinking if you didn't put holes in the pipe, that you make pipe work for filters that would be hiding in plain sight.

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

> what kind of paints would be safe to use?


After quite a bit of research on this a while back, I have found that the Liquitex BASICS brand of water based acrylics is safest. For terrestrial use the paint must be sealed with a water based clear urethane sealer, matte or gloss finish. For aquatic use, an epoxy based sealer approved for aquaculture use should be used. 
Colors are also important. Green, Blue, red and many yellows should not be used due to the use of amphibian toxic metals as pigmentation.



> Johnny, in the mean time would you take commissions?


 Yes, I will take commissions. For all members of Frogforum and the Caudata sites these are available at cost +shipping. 

I will be honest though, I need a week to get more sizes of PVC. I made these with leftovers from a home remodel project I did last year. Anything over 3 inches in diameter I have to order in, so there is a lead time of a couple of weeks. 

I have a horrid work schedule for about the next nine days so I will post up on here when I can start crafting and shipping.

If anyone is interested, please pm me with the sizes you would like.That will make it easier to get the pipe I need. (Length and diameter) I can get all standard sizes of Schedule 80 PVC up to 24 inches in diameter. Anything over 4 inches in diameter has a length limit of five feet. Also the big diameter pipe can get expensive (124USD for 5 feet of 8 inch dia!!!!). I have some contacts in the construction industry I will contact, I bet I can get their scraps for cheap.




> Thats simply incredible! You could make a living building enclosures for zoos. I was thinking if you didn't put holes in the pipe, that you make pipe work for filters that would be hiding in plain sight.


 Thank you! I agree, sans actual holes that penetrate the pipe, you can do that and more, like hiding wires and such. I can make actual holes or "fake" holes too, so it will look like a rotten log, but the pipe integrity is intact.


If you know any zoos that need an enclosure guy, please let me know...our local zoo is not hiring.

----------


## Kurt

Our local zoo is in finacial trouble at the moment, but I do have connections over there. So who knows, when things get better they may end up contacting you. Also I did send some of the pictures you posted to my former boss, the curator of live animals at the Museum of Science in Boston and to the director of the New England Wildlife Center. Both men are on vaction at the moment. Come to think of it the only intitution that I have connections to that I did not e-mail was the Museum of Natural History at Harvard University. Their animals are all dead and stuffed. I don't have any connections at the New England Aquarium, but the guys at zoo and the MoS do.

----------


## John Clare

I have a number of zoo connections throughout the US and I can honestly say I know of none of them that employs someone just to do terraria - that is usually part of a larger job description.  In any case, in the present economic climate you'll be hard pressed to find any zoo job.  Quite a few zoos have let people go.  Dallas Zoo (which is publicly owned - unlike Fort Worth Zoo), for example, is restructuring and turning over management to a private body (i.e. going commercially run) and they're having everyone presently employed re-apply for their own jobs, even the director, in an effort to cut a lot of staff.

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

Yeah...it is fun to dream though...thanks for the information!

I am going to sleep for about 30 hours now... :Wink:

----------


## frogandtoad

Goodness Gracious Johnny! How did you work that magic?

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

I admit, I did these over the last week during downtime at work (gotta do something when there is nothing to fix at the shop- think Maytag man!). I had made one last year as an experiment from a piece of scrap. It was not very good. Last week, we had a small electrical fire that warped a piece of PVC pipe for a industrial gluing system. The pipe sagged and bent. It hit me like a ton of bricks...Use a torch to bend the pipe, then carve it up!

My _Hyla chysoscelis_ were suffering a bit due to a lack of hides a suitable branches to roost on, so I went and bought a piece of PVC and took it to work. These were the end result.

Hopefully tonight I can try my hand at painting one up. A double split shift on short notice really screwed up my Vivaria hobby plans the last few days. :Stick Out Tongue:

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

Here are some more pieces to examine:

These are made from 6 inch PVC. Only thing different on these is a coating of epoxy based texture. These peices are on commission, so this is a an excellent surface prep for painting. (I haven't painted the original branches yet as they are currently inhabited by some very happy Hyla chrysoscelis...and the little buggers do not want to come out of them when the lights are on!)

And here they are again with the first few coats of paint:

----------


## John Clare

Fantastic as usual, but it's hard to get a sense of scale from those - what size are they?  Can you put something like a ruler in the photos?  If I were keeping warm-loving toads in with those, I would be concerned that the dark colour would absorb a lot of heat so they wouldn't be inviting hiding places.  Are they short enough to fit sideways in a 10 gallon?  A 20?

----------


## Wambli

how much for one that my bullfrog could get into... I would think a 4" pipe... 6" long... how much would you charge... they look great

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

> Fantastic as usual, but it's hard to get a sense of scale from those - what size are they?  Can you put something like a ruler in the photos?  If I were keeping warm-loving toads in with those, I would be concerned that the dark colour would absorb a lot of heat so they wouldn't be inviting hiding places.  Are they short enough to fit sideways in a 10 gallon?  A 20?



I'll post some "scale" pictures when I return home from work. This batch of 11 pieces ranges from about ten inches to 18 inches. 

I too thought of the color issue, however, once the painting is finished they will be much lighter in color. You make a valid point though...I will do some testing in different set ups and lighting with a IR thermometer.

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

> how much for one that my bullfrog could get into... I would think a 4" pipe... 6" long... how much would you charge... they look great


  Send me a PM, sorry about the delay, last week was an epic overtime week a t work for me.



Also, here are the "scale" pictures I promised, of the 6 inch diameter half logs. 

That's a female _Bufo nebulifer_ in the log hide. She is just over 6 inches long nose to vent...


And not to be out done, the males get to try them out too. Sure enough, they like "tree holes"... :Stick Out Tongue: 


The male visible is about 4.5 inches nose to vent. (John, that is the biggest of the males there.)

Since these logs have been exposed to my critters, I am in process of making more of this type over the next couple of weeks. The two inch branch style are in the works too- I am still a bit swamped at the moment.

----------


## John Clare

I'm very impressed Johnny.  I'm in your customer line.

----------


## BJnMe

How much time do you have in a log made out of say 2" 12" long.

Your work is awesome.

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

I can knock out the carving at a rate of about a foot per hour. Painting usually adds a few days to the process. Lately my "real" job has been interfereing, since I injured both hands repairing a broken steam line. :EEK!: 

*On that note, a few of you have orders that will be shipping out next week! I will contact you via pm/email this evening once I get my inventory finished* I apologize for the delays some of you have experienced...demand has been significantly higher than I had ever expected. I have actually resorted to adding two assistants to the project to get things caught up.

_New photographs showing paint schemes and the addition of quite a few new products will follow in the very near future, as will a website with automated ordering._ (I am quite behind on this aspect as I have been swamped as of late!)

Many thanks to everyone that has shown interest in this project...it looks like my critters will be eating very well! :Wink:

----------


## fatfrog

I'm an unemployed glass blower with all the time in the world...want an apprentice?  :Smile:

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

Pm me, if you want, you can take over! I am an over employed technician with no free time anymore...LOL

----------


## dinosaur

Hey! Im new on this forum but not new to herps. I have not had an amphibian setup in about 7 years and have been tossing around the Idea of getting some frogs and setting up a few vivariums. I saw this post and thought it was genius. I just figured I would try to make a pvc log out of some scrap pvc I had laying around borrowing your idea. Heres a pic of my rough log. I still have to clean it up and paint it. Tell me what you think for a first try. Any pointers?

----------


## dinosaur

Ok. Well, someone told me that they would be concerned about the release of dioxin from the burned pvc. I did a little research and It is only released as the pvc burns. I didnt want to chance it so I sealed the entire piece with non toxic shellac. After a second coat of shellac I dusted the piece in and out with coco fiber and let it dry for a couple hours. I then brushed it gently to remove loose coco fiber. The next step will be to add a epiphite or 2 and some moss for effect. Here is what I have as of now.

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

Brilliant! Looks great to me. I bet once it settles in with the humidity of a pet enclosure, you could even get some live moss growing on this version of the project. Good on you!

----------


## dinosaur

Thanks. I am going to try to get some live moss to grow on it once I have my viv setup. Now the wheels are turning in my head. Thats a scary thing.

----------


## willtilian

if your selling i am buying

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

> Thanks. I am going to try to get some live moss to grow on it once I have my viv setup. Now the wheels are turning in my head. Thats a scary thing.


That is the problem with DIY projects like these. They quickly become an addiction. One of these days I will get around to finishing the four foot tall PVC "tree" I started for my Hyla chrysoscelis and post up the pics. My problem is my "real" job gets in the way of everything else.

----------


## dinosaur

I hear that. I am in the process of building a big encolsure for my mangrove monitor and I think I am going to try some pvc branches in there for him to climb on. Maybe mimic some mangrove roots or something. More wheels turning.
I just got home from my herp society xmas bbq that we had at "Reptile world serpentarium" in St cloud fl. I brought my pvc log to show a couple of the frog guys and everybody thought it was a real log at first. I think that means I did somethin right. They want me to do a presentation on how to make them at a meeting. They also told me to bring a few to sell. Once they see how much work is involved, idk if they would make them anyway. Well, im going to make a bunch of these things and see if I can speed the process up and try to come up with a price for them. Thanks again sludgemunkey for the inspiration.

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

It is really not that much work I feel, just messy. I knocked out most of the pieces pictured here on my lunch breaks at work. LOL

Please feel free to use my pictures in your presentation if you so desire. (I can e-mail you hi-res originals if you like. Contact me via PM) 

I am very excited to see that others are expanding on this project. *All I ask is that you plug that you found it here on FrogForum.net!*

----------


## CrazyAirborne

So what ever came of this? Are you still taking orders? These logs look awesome.

----------


## Dwhiteman11

Brilliant idea. What did you use to make all the indents and lines to make them look so real?

----------


## Judy S

I know that this thread is old, but I just came across it today...am very..very new to the herp world and am doing a lot of reading..these "logs" are wonderful...the split ends and hidey holes are great...how do they get made???  The brands of paint --are they USA available...and what kind of techniques do you use for the actual paint part?  Have you ever tried to attach a "branch" using a predrilled hole or adhesive to further your log science???  Hopefully you will read this message...Thanks, Judy

----------


## Sherry

These are awesome! I want one.

----------


## Gail

That is AWESOME!!   :Big Applause:  Looks like ALOT of time put into one piece.

----------


## Lady medusa

Man those are awesome! Im kicking myself for not thinking of that sooner! Sludge monkey Your right about not using most yellows, red, green, and blue paint especially anything that says cadmium! But id figure one it was sealed it wouldnt leech anything. Have you looked into soy paint? Its supposidly completely non toxic/ eco friendly and is made of soy beans! It comes in all colors too. Im using it at the moment to make a fake coral reef for my crazy idea of a cal king enclosure( i figure since they look like sea kraits why not make a terrarium reef).  I cant wait to see your tree! have u thought of using an air brush to paint some of your stuff? As u asked about finding a zoo job look on AZA website. They publicate job listings for zoos there. I worked at OKC zoo for quite a while and i can say our graphics and design crew never made anything nearly that impressive. Our mangrove tree in the aquatics department was a sad sight i must say! Super duper fake looking and falling apart. We made a "rain screen" to help cover the eyesore. In the herp department they made their own stuff but like most of us they used the traditional stuff. My department wasnt so lucky to do even that because of our constricting overhead :Frown:

----------


## Judy S

> The wheels in my head are turning...
> 
> Even crazier, I just discovered I can get the pipe in diameters all the way up to 24 inches!
> 
>  With that range of sizes , heck, one could make a whole dead tree!
> 
> I am going to have to crunch some numbers here. Time is the hard part at the moment. However, the long boring winter will be here soon...


  Sludge Munkey...are you reading these posts???  I'd love to ask you a few more questions and probably some new posters would as well...

----------


## Johnny O. Farnen

I'm still around, sort of. 

I have taken to merely lurking about as I  got fired from my "day" job and am working on finishing a double major in biology and chemistry. (That is how I am going to get a real job working with critters one of these days!) The good news is the weather is shifting here now, so I am winding down from my home remodeling projects. This frees up time for more work on vivaria, my vivaria DIY book, and of course, enjoying my critters.

Sadly, I had to give up long ago on selling this fake wood. Truth be told, I just cannot keep up with requests.(And get easily distracted onto other projects) It takes me roughly three hours just to carve a 6 inch piece. I have also found the a pneumatic die grinder is superior to a dremel tool for this project. As I no longer have access to pneumatic tools, this slows the process down even more.

Right now, I literally have a room full of numerous vivaria projects in various states of completion, but I find my studies limit my available "play" time quite a bit.

----------


## BG

Johny i know how you feel. I started on a job way over due. Im cleaning out my boiler room . Its a job and a half. But it will make a nice little frog/critter room. I had to add new shelves . Sorry to here about your job. Its not easy today but we must hang in there. I like your "Imitwood"  idea, see i even came up with a name.lol

----------


## Poly

Those logs are amazing! Sorry to hear the bad news reguarding your job, times are hard in a lot of places, but you will get through it... after all, you've got frogs!  :Wink:

----------


## IrishRonin

So i know this is an old thread but, GREAT job! I'm gonna have to try it myself. I am lucky enough to work at a animal park and like everyone said I have a small overhead so this is perfect. Thanks for the idea and if anyone asks I'd send them this way. Keep that mind rolling,new projects are always the best

----------


## optimum

that is what i call ART~  Very nice mate!

----------


## RobinLee2011

These do look great however please read the following:
_Studies of construction fires point to another major hazard of playa burning. PVC -- the playa construction material of choice -- is highly dangerous to both personal health and the environment when burned. PVC is one of the worst offenders when it comes to toxic substances. PVC can emit highly corrosive and toxic hydrogen chloride when burned. It is also is a source of dioxin and phosgene gas when burned at temperatures below complete combustion. Coincidentally, phosgene, an odorless gas that can damage the lungs, is one of the substances used in chemical warfare. Samples of soot taken from fires in PVC-containing buildings that have burned have been found to contain dioxins in very high concentrations. The soot, however, represents only a small part of the problem: more than 90 of the dioxins produced in a structural fire are found in the gaseous phase and escape into the atmosphere.

For these reasons, PVC should never be burned. Please make sure anything to be burned is PVC-free._

----------


## Sarah

I am thinking that my axolotls would love to have one or two of these in their tank. When you have some free time, I may just have to commission you for a couple of half logs and some branches (for my tree frogs).

----------

