# Frogs & Toads > Dart Frogs (Dendrobatidae) > Beginner Discussion >  Beginner dart frog?

## Pac man

What's a good dart frog for beginners?


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## Ryan

I would say Eppobates tricolor would be a good beginner dart frog or Dendrobates Leucomelas

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## Pac man

Thanks I 'll look into them


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## Tonya Freeman

There are a few choices for good beginner dart frogs. Alot of it depends on what type of setup you want, if you are looking into getting a single frog, pair/trio, or frogs that get along well in a group.

Dendrobates Tinctorius are a good, hardy, and bold beginner frog. They do not do well in groups once they are mature.
Dendrobates Leucomelas are a very hardy, very bold and active frog. They do well in groups and will use all of the space that you give them.
Dendrobates Auratus are a good choice too, although some can be fairly shy.
Phyllobates Terribilis or Bicolors would make a nice choice as well. Extremely bold, does well in groups. You would need to keep dryer areas in the viv because too much moisture can result in sores on their feet.
Epipedobates Anthonyi would also be a nice choice for a beginner frog.

Just to add a bit more to this, Leucomelas were my first darts. I've enjoyed them from the day they arrived. They are always active (I can almost always see at least 3 of the 5 at any given time), they are great eaters, and they are very forgiving of rookie mistakes. I'm housing 5 in a 24x18x24 exo terra and they use every square inch that they can get to.

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## nok1888

> Dendrobates Tinctorius are a good, hardy, and bold beginner frog. They do not do well in groups once they are mature.


Are tinctorius and azureus 2 different frogs? I was thinking of keeping 3-5 azureus depending on the size of terrarium I get, not sure if the do well in groups though



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## Ryan

Yes tincs and azerus are two different species, the rule of thumb with large darts such as the dendrobates is 5 gallons per frog, so 5 frogs can go in a 30 gallon tank. they tend to do best in groups as well  :Smile:  you are going to love the azerus!

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## Pac man

I thank I'm getting luecomelas  as I like them the most 


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## Tonya Freeman

> Are tinctorius and azureus 2 different frogs? I was thinking of keeping 3-5 azureus depending on the size of terrarium I get, not sure if the do well in groups though


They are considered to be tincs, although things were recently changed to classify Azureus as their own species. Azureus females are very territorial and can be just mean at times. It is not impossible to keep a group of them.. but when dealing with a tinc species it is best to keep them in pairs or male heavy trios. 

Now.. that being said, if you were going to keep a large group of Azureus, I would really recommend a HUGE setup. Most I've heard of who attempt to do that are working with over 100 gallon vivs. They are set up to include many visual barriers. Males will get along fine as long as they each have their own calling spot. Females are mostly territoral of the males in the group. If you have an extremely male heavy group of 4.1 or possibly 3.2 you may be fine if they are all added as juveniles. You would need to be prepared to pull any frogs out that are not thriving once maturity hits. Having them grow up together will be a lot easier than introducing adult Azureus to each other. Even with juveniles, as they mature you will probably see some wrestling. That is fine at first (or even occasionally) as long as it doesn't get to the point where they are stressing a particular frog.

Some people do just fine with a large tinc group.. but majority have found it to be better when having a pair or trio. You could always start off with a group and pair them up as they age to split into 2 enclosures as well. That would help with stress, aggression, and breeding if you were planning on going that route. Females will eat the other females eggs in some situations.





> I thank I'm getting luecomelas as I like them the most


I think that is a great choice. I adore mine. Their call is beautiful, although louder than most. It resembles a bird chip of some sorts.. and really gives that rainforest feeling!

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## Pac man

How big of a tank would I need for a breeding pair of luecomelas ?


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## Tonya Freeman

I would say for an adult breeding pair, 10 gallons would be fine. Anything over that they would love. For Leucomelas I would recommend finding some nice wood pieces (or cork rounds) and attaching them to the background to make different climbing levels. If you are looking into breeding them you should know that they are seasonal breeders. You will hear calling when they have been heavily misted and well fed. To slow down their breeding, just lessen their feeding amount and mist a little less often. They can get to the point where they will overwhelm you with eggs! You can also remove the cocohut to slow it down as well.

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## Pac man

Hey thanks I have the zoomed medium I thank is 18x12x18 might be wrong on that tho will this be big enough?


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## Tonya Freeman

Yes, that would be great for them. I have the 24x18x24 with a group of 5 and they are all happy.. so a pair in your tank would be great. By adding background 'ledges' you are increasing the space inside the tank.. so the more areas you give them off of the ground really adds to their space well. 

If you haven't had a front opening tank before.. I think you will really enjoy it. So much easier to mist and feed.. as well as trim back plants. Just make sure you keep an eye on your little guy/gal so they don't dart out when you aren't paying attention. I've never had them attempt to do it.. but I've heard stories about other frogs trying. Mostly thumbnails.. but still have to be cautious  :Wink:

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## Pac man

Thanks I plan on putting tons of plants and places for them to hide as I hear that the more you give them to hide the more they'll be out


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## Tonya Freeman

That is very true. If they know that they have a close hiding spot they seem to worry less about coming out in the open. Leucomelas are pretty bold anyways though. When I open the tank they get into their 'feeding circle' to wait for the flies to drop. If I'm late feeding them they sit at the glass as if they are looking for me... like they are doing right now lol. 

Cocohut, leaf litter, a little nook or two beside some wood.. that is really all that they would need to feel secure. I'm sure you will really enjoy them! Best of luck you you and your frogs  :Smile:

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## Pac man

What plants would you say are good to put in with them?


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## Tonya Freeman

Well, that really depends on your experience with plants and how often you are willing to trim them back. 

I'm personally a plant killer. I've never been able to keep a houseplant alive for longer than a month. That worried me with this hobby. I've found a nice selection of hardy plants that work well though.. although some of them have their own issues. 

You can use pothos or wandering jew. They are both hardy, nearly impossible to kill.. but can quickly take over your viv if you aren't careful. The leaves are large enough to support the frogs climbing. Prayer plant is also another one that fits well into this section.
Most begonias work really well.. and add a bit of color
Pilea can be gorgeous.. but tends to get leggy and spaced out if not trimmed 
I always use a few bromeliads in each viv.. but they aren't needed for leucs. They just give a bit of an exotic look when pushed into the background. They will rot if put into the substrate so you would need to either attach them to the background or a piece of wood.
A nice tropical fern would be hardy and give some hiding spots
There are also quite a few species of peperomia that would be great. Some add a bit of color.

Now.. if you are more experienced then there are beautiful mini orchids, more exotic tropical plants (with higher price tags), and almost an endless assortment to choose from.

If you aren't sure what would work well in that size tank, a lot of sponsors (like Josh's Frogs) have plant packages that you can order for your size viv. You don't get to choose the exact plants.. but you are given a great assortment.

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