# Frogs & Toads > Pacman Frogs >  Is it a bad idea to pick and handle your Pacman?

## Ebenezer Frothingham

Amphibians are not cuddly pets like cats or dogs- Mine has an absolute aversion to being touched, as I assume my frog is terrified he/she will be eaten.
I've been watching some Pacman frog videos made by frog owners on Yotube where owners pick up and handle their pacmans. Is that a good or bad idea? 

I suppose i just want my frog to be desesitized to me- right now i think he sees me as some giant creature that might eat him. I have never picked up my Pacman with my bare hands- Should I keep it that way, or is minimum handling okay? I'd like him to trust me enough to accept food from tongs..

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## Poly

The frog will eventually get used to being handled, when I first got my toad, it would pee when it was picked up, which indacted it was scared, but around a week later, it stopped, now 3 months later, it hasn't peeded since then.

I pick my toad up and set it down to feed it, then once it has been fed, I pick it back up, and put it back in it's tank. I'm sure it's used to the routine by now, it also helps if you feed your frog at the same time every day, I feed my toad at lunch every day, and it will stay burried under it's moss until around 11:45, then it comes up.

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## Sublime

Yeah my frog hates being picked up, he's got a little more used to the routine though.  I pick him up out of his water bowl to change it, or pick him up to set him inside a feeding bin.  As they get used to a more routine handling, he should start to understand and calm down a little bit.  You can pick up your pacman with your bare hands, just not too much handling or it will get stressed.  The only time I handle my frog as was mentioned above, other than that I just watch him for enjoyment.  I have to cup my pixie with the top of my hand so he doesn't jump out, when I'm about to set him in his tank I open up my hand and he stays on it so hopefully he gets more used to me.  I'm sure yours will settle in.

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## Sublime

By the way a lot of frog owners are not very smart to put it nicely on youtube, you'll see them sometimes poking their pacmans to make them get mad or feed them on ridiculous bedding like rocks, bark, moss.  Or you'll see them feeding them mice regularly which is bad for their health.

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## Ebenezer Frothingham

> By the way a lot of frog owners are not very smart to put it nicely on youtube, you'll see them sometimes poking their pacmans to make them get mad or feed them on ridiculous bedding like rocks, bark, moss.  Or you'll see them feeding them mice regularly which is bad for their health.



Live feedings seem to most common kind of Pacman (and Pixie)  frog video on Youtube- It's fairy obvious many pacman owners are feeding their frogs mice that are much too large. I have no problems feeding pacmans mice- thats what they eat (and as an occasional treat)  but the videos where they eat mice, where people in the backround can be heard cheering and laughing are just sadistic. I have noticed many videos of pacman frogs show dangerous examples of substrait- often moss, or fishtank gravel- sometimes, no substrait at all, and just a bare tank. Not a good thing for a burrowing frog. 
There are a number of videos of sadistic pacman owners posting videos on Youtube of them poking their frog to get it to bark and hiss. Very uncool- why would someone enjoy tormenting their pet? I feel sorry for those frogs. Do they do the same thing to their dog or cat? I'm reluctant to touch my pacman in any way for fear it wiull stress him out.
This is an example of a bad pacman owner:

http://youtu.be/_gbFQzsmEZQ

why would someone delibertly stress out their frog this way?
Plus a potentially lethal substrait. Stones????

Do NOT poke your pacman like this :

http://youtu.be/bC9P1EavtfU

Owners  like that really anger me

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## Poly

> Ornate Pacman Frog getting defensive! - YouTube
> 
> Owners like that really anger me


Agreed. Tormenting their pet frog... for entertainment!? It's terrible how these people treat there frogs!

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## IvoryReptiles

I agree that tormenting the frogs is in-excusable, but to assume from a video that the substrate in the video is the living conditions for the frog is, well, silly.

We have some videos of our frogs being fed or their reactions to my camera lens cap (the frog was trying to eat it), but the video is taken with the frog in it's feeding bin, not it's normal enclosure. I have video of our breeders in the rain chamber. And yes, we have video of some of our frogs eating mice or pinkies......as a treat once every 2 months. Mammalian proteins are difficult (NOT impossible) for them to digest. Poultry is easier on them, mealworms are not.....the exoskeletons are not digestible and can cause blockages if fed too often and in mass quantities. They love earthworms, crickets are okay. The tadpoles devour bloodworms and even carnivorous fish foods. But they would rather have other tadpoles......we get plenty of Gulf Coast Toads spawning in our ponds and will collect them & offer them when available. Variety is the key to healthy diets for these guys.

Sorry, went way off subject there! We handle ours when we are cleaning & when we feed them. In time they become more accustomed to it, but they are not huggy & kissy frogs....LOL
When I want to handle a frog, I will take my Dumpy frogs out and let them crawl on me or sit with me while I cruise the internet.

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## Colleen/Jerrod

It is ok to handle your Pacman in moderation. As everyone has mentioned they can become stressed easily. When you do handle your Pac make sure to wash your hands thoroughly to remove the oils from your hands which can harm them. Use a mild cleanser nothing that will leave heavy scents or residues. The more you handle them the more they get used to you but it must be done so over time. Also if they feel threatened they may bite which can be quite painful if its an adult Pacman. Don't let that discourage you too much. Your frog probably won't bite you. Be very careful not to drop your frog either. They can be injured or killed easily. Make them feel secure by cuppkng your hands around the frog be ferm so it doesn't jump out but gentle at the same time so you don't squeeze the frog. It takes time but your frog will eventually get used to you.

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## Sublime

> I agree that tormenting the frogs is in-excusable, but to assume from a video that the substrate in the video is the living conditions for the frog is, well, silly.
> 
> We have some videos of our frogs being fed or their reactions to my camera lens cap (the frog was trying to eat it), but the video is taken with the frog in it's feeding bin, not it's normal enclosure. I have video of our breeders in the rain chamber. And yes, we have video of some of our frogs eating mice or pinkies......as a treat once every 2 months. Mammalian proteins are difficult (NOT impossible) for them to digest. Poultry is easier on them, mealworms are not.....the exoskeletons are not digestible and can cause blockages if fed too often and in mass quantities. They love earthworms, crickets are okay. The tadpoles devour bloodworms and even carnivorous fish foods. But they would rather have other tadpoles......we get plenty of Gulf Coast Toads spawning in our ponds and will collect them & offer them when available. Variety is the key to healthy diets for these guys.
> 
> Sorry, went way off subject there! We handle ours when we are cleaning & when we feed them. In time they become more accustomed to it, but they are not huggy & kissy frogs....LOL
> When I want to handle a frog, I will take my Dumpy frogs out and let them crawl on me or sit with me while I cruise the internet.


Yeah I understand what you're talking about, but I've seen pacman owners housing their frogs in a permanent tank with incorrect substrate...not a feeding bin.  Even the feeding bins they have them in sometimes is what we are talking about, they place gravel and water in it or small rocks and feed them in it.  That's a disaster waiting to happen...  The dumpy whites tree frogs are an exception, they can be held for awhile.  They are awesome frogs as well.

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## Ebenezer Frothingham

> It is ok to handle your Pacman in moderation. As everyone has mentioned they can become stressed easily. When you do handle your Pac make sure to wash your hands thoroughly to remove the oils from your hands which can harm them. Use a mild cleanser nothing that will leave heavy scents or residues. The more you handle them the more they get used to you but it must be done so over time. Also if they feel threatened they may bite which can be quite painful if its an adult Pacman. Don't let that discourage you too much. Your frog probably won't bite you. Be very careful not to drop your frog either. They can be injured or killed easily. Make them feel secure by cuppkng your hands around the frog be ferm so it doesn't jump out but gentle at the same time so you don't squeeze the frog. It takes time but your frog will eventually get used to you.


Great points, i'll try that. I'll try and avoid getting bitten-Ill pick him/her up from behind, although i have a feeling the frog with the most powerful bite are pixie frogs

I can't imagine pacmans are fast at hopping away...

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## Colleen/Jerrod

> Great points, i'll try that. I'll try and avoid getting bitten-Ill pick him/her up from behind, although i have a feeling the frog with the most powerful bite are pixie frogs
> 
> I can't imagine pacmans are fast at hopping away...


You'd be surprised just how far one of those tubby Pacs can jump. My chubby boy Grif can jump 5 times his body length if he wants to. I've seen him do it. And the babies are pretty spry. My little baby Green C. cranwelli is fast and can jump about 5 times its body length as well. They do actually have pretty strong rear legs. They just conserve their energy.

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## BG

If you think that's sadistic, then you should see how they treat there natural resourses in south america. I saw a video on you tube people stuffing cigarettes in the pacmans mouth. After they had their laugh, they took a bat and used the frog as a baseball, nough said. :Mad:  :AR15: 


> Live feedings seem to most common kind of Pacman (and Pixie)  frog video on Youtube- It's fairy obvious many pacman owners are feeding their frogs mice that are much too large. I have no problems feeding pacmans mice- thats what they eat (and as an occasional treat)  but the videos where they eat mice, where people in the backround can be heard cheering and laughing are just sadistic. I have noticed many videos of pacman frogs show dangerous examples of substrait- often moss, or fishtank gravel- sometimes, no substrait at all, and just a bare tank. Not a good thing for a burrowing frog. 
> There are a number of videos of sadistic pacman owners posting videos on Youtube of them poking their frog to get it to bark and hiss. Very uncool- why would someone enjoy tormenting their pet? I feel sorry for those frogs. Do they do the same thing to their dog or cat? I'm reluctant to touch my pacman in any way for fear it wiull stress him out.
> This is an example of a bad pacman owner:
> 
> ONE PISSED OFF PACMAN!!!! - YouTube
> 
> why would someone delibertly stress out their frog this way?
> Plus a potentially lethal substrait. Stones????
> 
> ...

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## Colleen/Jerrod

> If you think that's sadistic, then you should see how they treat there natural resourses in south america. I saw a video on you tube people stuffing cigarettes in the pacmans mouth. After they had their laugh, they took a bat and used the frog as a baseball, nough said.


Alright now that makes me mad. If I saw one of them do that I would have to say id take the bat from them and hit them with it. Stuff like that just blows my mind. It just makes no sence to me why someone would do that.

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## Ebenezer Frothingham

> If you think that's sadistic, then you should see how they treat there natural resourses in south america. I saw a video on you tube people stuffing cigarettes in the pacmans mouth. After they had their laugh, they took a bat and used the frog as a baseball, nough said.



Sounds like serial killers in the making. They start off by torturing small animals to death

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## BG

Exactly. These are your future serial killers and  what ever has to do with evil. That was an ornate by the way. I don't know what country that was but yea that what happened


> Sounds like serial killers in the making. They start off by torturing small animals to death

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## Colleen/Jerrod

> Exactly. These are your future serial killers and  what ever has to do with evil. That was an ornate by the way. I don't know what country that was but yea that what happened


some people have no heart.

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## Sprout

My Ornate used to freak out when I'd pick him up to feed / clean out his tank and urinate everywhere. Sadly a while ago he got an impaction, so I'd be handling him more to give medicine and warm soaks. Since then he's been pretty calm when I've handed him, think he trusts me now but it took a while. Good luck with your frog  :Smile:

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## bshmerlie

Frogs , for the most part, don't like to be held.

Frogs that are desensitized to handling= Stockholm syndrome

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## Colleen/Jerrod

> Frogs , for the most part, don't like to be held.
> 
> Frogs that are desensitized to handling= Stockholm syndrome


That is a very valid statement considering they are supposed to be wild and technically a captive even if born in captivity.

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## BG

They freak out cause they think they're going to get eaten.  They are out of place being up  high  from the ground.  They love that dirt,like fish love water. Did you ever see a wtf burry him self in dirt.  I never did.  So right there ,like everyone said,nonononono and no handleing to much.

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## Ebenezer Frothingham

> They freak out cause they think they're going to get eaten.  They are out of place being up  high  from the ground.  They love that dirt,like fish love water. Did you ever see a wtf burry him self in dirt.  I never did.  So right there ,like everyone said,nonononono and no handleing to much.



This is one reason why i suspect pacmans who live an bare tanks with no substrate get very stressed. if they cant burrow and hide, how will they feel secure?

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## hophappygirl

I have heard you aren't supposed to handle pacmans, but pacmans aren't my area of expertise.

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## Ebenezer Frothingham

> I work in a fiberglass factory and we use a lot of harmful chemicals yet there is an. American Toad that lives in the factry. I've come to work at 4 in the morning and found him chasing spiders around for a snack. He's been there since I've been working th er. I've worked there for 5 years. Pretty tough toad. His burrow is in a crack in the concrete floor and its lined with fiberglass and it obviously doesn't bother him at all.



What an amazing toad- Toads seem to be one of the most adaptable creatures in the frog kingdom. What does he do for food?

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## BG

To get back to the  thread. Yes its a bad idea to pick up and handle your pacman and if you do,your'e watching to much youtube.lol

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## IvoryReptiles

And one of my favorites.....The Airport Search...........



Did that help?? LOL  :Big Grin:

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## IvoryReptiles

> Since I don't share your religious beleifs, we'll never agree on that subject-
> 
> But clearly we both like frogs, so at least there we can find common ground..
> 
> 
> and back on the thread- I was thinking when handling frogs, would using latex gloves be a good idea? i wouldn't want soap from my hands to irritate my frog- but do they react badly to latex? The only time I really need to touch him is when i change out the substrait


We wash our hands with Dawn dish soap and rinse them very well, dry them completely and then use de-chlorinated water that we use for the frog's enclosures to saturate our hands before we handle them. Not sure what chemicals they could pick up from the latex, but since I'm allergic to it, I don't want to chance the frogs having a bad reaction to it.

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## BG

The one that is yellow and brown spots will the yellow go away? Jessica thank you for the pics.i like the yellowbrownspots.

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## IvoryReptiles

> The one that is yellow and brown spots will the yellow go away? Jessica thank you for the pics.i like the yellowbrownspots.


Movie Quote : "Even the Wisest cannot say."
We have held back some of them and in some the yellow intensifies and in others it turns pastel.

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## John Clare

I have read through all of this.  I am glad you have resolved this but I still don't want to leave the thread as it stands.  This community is not the place to debate religion, or politics for that matter.  Please don't do that again.  I'll leave this message here for a few days but I'm going to start pruning.  I hope you can understand why.  If you have something more to say on the matter, please do not reply here - send me a private message.

*Someone asked me what pruning means:* *it means removing the off-topic messages from the thread.*

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## Sprout

> Frogs , for the most part, don't like to be held.
> 
> Frogs that are desensitized to handling= Stockholm syndrome


I totally agree, I apologise if my post sounded like I'm constantly picking up my frog, I meant when it is necessary to move him I'm glad he's no longer scared  :Smile:  I wouldn't advise anyone to to handle their frogs for no reason...

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## Colleen/Jerrod

> What an amazing toad- Toads seem to be one of the most adaptable creatures in the frog kingdom. What does he do for food?


There are always spiders and insects that are inside the building. I've seen him chasing spiders in winter. Its funny. He was always 2 hops behind the sider the whole time. He isn't that scared of people either, but I guess that's from living among us for so long.

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## Colleen/Jerrod

> We wash our hands with Dawn dish soap and rinse them very well, dry them completely and then use de-chlorinated water that we use for the frog's enclosures to saturate our hands before we handle them. Not sure what chemicals they could pick up from the latex, but since I'm allergic to it, I don't want to chance the frogs having a bad reaction to it.


I've read not to use latex gloves. You can buy non latex vinyl gloves that are supposed to be safe and have no chemical residue or powder. I prefer to wash my bare hands thoroughly and handle them.

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## Sublime

You can also use disposable Nitrile gloves made from an organic compound as an alternative for people who are allergic to Latex.  I still would rather take the approach that Ivory is doing, wash your hands thoroughly and get a little bit of their coco fiber on your hands and then pick them up.  I just get a little scared of the material stretching their sensitive skin, plus I like to be able to feel my little guy when I need to move him  :Smile: .

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