What frog to have in a 12x12x24 vivarium?

[Necromencer]

Hey there,

I'm in trouble as to what type of dart frog to get for this enclosure. It's very narrow, but very high, so I was thinking an arboreal frog would be happier in there?

I was thinking of R. imitator, but they are for more experienced keepers, what makes them more difficult? I've been checking my humidity, temp and fruit fly supplies for weeks, and all seems to be okay.

But I was wondering what other frogs I could have in here? It's heavily planted and I've made the background myself (with expanding foam, silicone and eco-earth) with many hiding places, holes and platforms.

Any help would be appreciated

[flybyferns]

Hi,
I was thinking of R. imitator, but they are for more experienced keepers, what makes them more difficult?

I think R. imitators is a great choice. I don't believe they are difficult, at all. At least mine are not.
They love to climb !
I have my "Varadero" in a 18" x 18" x 24 "H.... they use the entire tank.

Lynn

[Necromencer]

Hi,
I was thinking of R. imitator, but they are for more experienced keepers, what makes them more difficult?

I think R. imitators is a great choice. I don't believe they are difficult, at all. At least mine are not.
They love to climb !
I have my "Varadero" in a 18" x 18" x 24 "H.... they use the entire tank.

Lynn

Thanks for the prompt reply.

How many frogs would inhabit this vivarium comfortably? I would love 4, but I've seen people with 12x12x18 saying that a mating pair is pushing the limit.

I was going for Ranitomeya Imitator 'Jebero' (sp?)

[flybyferns]

You're welcome

Yes, I would put a single pair in an 18" high. Remember, after adding substrate it will be about 13" high, or so.
The space gets used up quickly by substrate, wood, plants etc.
I have not owned "Jebro"......... I don't know if their behavior is very different from "Varadero" having not personally observed them.

Perhaps poke around UE / maybe throw them an email.
Ranitomeya imitator | Understory Enterprises

Lynn

[Necromencer]

You're welcome

Yes, I would put a single pair in an 18" high. Remember, after adding substrate it will be about 13" high, or so.
The space gets used up quickly by substrate, wood, plants etc.
I have not owned "Jebro"......... I don't know if their behavior is very different from "Varadero" having not personally observed them.




Perhaps poke around UE / maybe throw them an email.
Ranitomeya imitator | Understory Enterprises

Lynn

Thanks for your imput. I've measured the tank and, with the substrate it's 19.5'' high. Would 3 frogs but too much?

I'll take a look into the varadero variety, but I've already found a UK supplier of R.I.Jebro for £60/frog

[flybyferns]

Thanks for your imput. I've measured the tank and, with the substrate it's 19.5'' high. Would 3 frogs but too much?

I'll take a look into the varadero variety, but I've already found a UK supplier of R.I.Jebro for £60/frog

Actually I would try to get a 'sexed' pair , if possible?
Unintentionally, I have 4 in my tank. It's a long story.
I'm very lucky to have ended up w/ 2 breeding pair. They paired off nicely.
I think it was because I acquired the 2nd pair about 4 months after the first.
The 2nd pair did not go into the enclosure w/ the other pair until an additional 45 day quarantine period.
Therefore, the 1 st pair's bond was well established. These are my thoughts- anyway
I have never witnessed any competition, but it needs careful monitoring.

It's really interesting to watch. They are always by each others sides. Sweet little cuties....... are very loyal

Lynn

[DartEd]

If you decide to go with more than a pair, which I don't recommend for an inexperienced hobbyist, keeping them in equal pairs is best. Lynn's situation is fortunate one as they're paired off equally and too busy courting/ breeding to be territorial. Provide plenty of plants and obstacles to break line of sight, provide multiple calling spots, at least 5 or 6 egg laying sites. These conditions offer the optimal chances of success. Imitators are territorial and females will eat each others eggs so careful monitoring is important.

If you want a good group frog for that tank, ventrimaculatus now know as Amazonica, are the thumbnail frog for that tank. You can keep 4-5 in the 24" vertical tank with little territorial issues. Plant well and provide the conditions I mentioned above and they'll breed so often you'll have to give away offspring. Best of luck to you

[Necromencer]

If you decide to go with more than a pair, which I don't recommend for an inexperienced hobbyist, keeping them in equal pairs is best. Lynn's situation is fortunate one as they're paired off equally and too busy courting/ breeding to be territorial. Provide plenty of plants and obstacles to break line of sight, provide multiple calling spots, at least 5 or 6 egg laying sites. These conditions offer the optimal chances of success. Imitators are territorial and females will eat each others eggs so careful monitoring is important.

If you want a good group frog for that tank, ventrimaculatus now know as Amazonica, are the thumbnail frog for that tank. You can keep 4-5 in the 24" vertical tank with little territorial issues. Plant well and provide the conditions I mentioned above and they'll breed so often you'll have to give away offspring. Best of luck to you

Thanks for the tips guys. On dartfrog.com, they sell x2 amazonica for £400... how much did you pay for your ones?

I'll just get a pair if I can't find cheaper amazonicae

[flybyferns]

Sorry Necromence, I did not pay for my imitators.
Mine were all , very, generously shared !

We share and pass the fun around

[Heatheranne]

I agree, I think darts are actually easier than some tree frogs, so long as the vivarium settings (temp and humidity) plus proper planting are right. Plus, no stinky crickets. My darts are the easiest of all of my species to present.

[flybyferns]

I agree, I think darts are actually easier than some tree frogs, so long as the vivarium settings (temp and humidity) plus proper planting are right. Plus, no stinky crickets. My darts are the easiest of all of my species to present.

I agree.
I think we're hooked Heath !

[Heatheranne]

I agree.
I think we're hooked Heath !

I completely agree!

[Necromencer]

What do you mean by proper planting? I understand the importance of plants in a vivarium, but what negative effects would a badly planted vivarium have?

[DartEd]

Darts take a lot of work about once a month trimming plants, cleaning glass etc. Otherwise I spend 20mins per day feeding and watering. And once per week about 45 minutes feeding and watering bugs and starting new cultures.

I believe proper planting means a proper variety of plants such as vining plants, trailing plants, bromeliads, and broad leafed terrestrial plants. Over planting crowds the tank and reduces your ability to locate frogs. Under planting leads to frogs hiding all the time and not being as bold as they could be.

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