Fantasy frogs vs Cranwelli health/hardiness

[reptileszz]

Hi fantasy frogs less hardy than cranwelli? I wonder as they are infertile hybrids and wouldnt breed naturally. I have googled it and can't seem to find an answer.

Carole

[Mentat]

Hi Carole ! From what I've read here; some strains of Fantasy's appear healthy and capable to reach maturity (common green & brown ones) while those high in reds colors rarely, if ever make it to maturity, possibly due to a bad gene mix-up. Not sure where the Tri-color Fantasy lands in the health and longevity area; have not seen a nice adult with reds on it yet.

[GrifTheGreat]

Hi Carole ! From what I've read here; some strains of Fantasy's appear healthy and capable to reach maturity (common green & brown ones) while those high in reds colors rarely, if ever make it to maturity, possibly due to a bad gene mix-up. Not sure where the Tri-color Fantasy lands in the health and longevity area; have not seen a nice adult with reds on it yet.

My theory on this is that the reason you don't see Red Fantasies as adults is because they do not stay red. They become rusty brown and the tricolors don't look the same either. Most of these frogs change drastically as they mature and a hybrid is more likely to shift between shades of color because of the mixed genes. So I don't think that each Fantasy has a difference in health. They just don't look anything like their original self once matured.

I haven't read much about different Fantasy morphs having compromised immune systems or poor genetics, but that doesn't mean that there isn't some truth to that. Many hybrids have health problems. Fantasy frogs seem to be an exception to the rule, but that doesn't mean that some of the Fantasies you see for sale are not weak genetically. Even the pure blood species can have weak indiviuals.

[Heatheranne]

They definitely fade, so unless you know their original genetics and/or parents it would be hard to know. You'd have to run a genetics and immunity study.

I have 2 fantasies. Both were mostly orange as juveniles. My male had red also. Both had green dorsal stripes. Both have faded to tan. Though, they are also both house on Eco Earth substrate which may also play a role in discoloration. My male held a small amount of his green dorsal stripe. I believe my male was ornate and cornuta mixed because he had some red and he has the posterior eye lid spots, as ornates do.

I have 3 pacman frogs, 1 cranwelli, 2 fantasies. In terms of their immunity...I only have 2 so I can't really compare. My male has never had health problems other than I bought him having calcium deficiency tetany which was easy to correct. My female fantasy frog has digestive issues. She is a poor eater and has difficulty passing her stools at times. My female brown cranwelli has no issues.

Here are some pics of their color changes.

Tank - female brown cranwelli


Chomper - female fantasy frog


Bruiser - male fantasy frog


I'd be interested to hear others experiences with their fantasies. It'd be great if everyone could share juvenile and adult pictures too.

Reptileszz, are you looking to purchase a fantasy frog or do you have one/some? This is a great question, btw .

[reptileszz]

Thats for the great responses. I purchased a baby fantasy frog in Daytona 3 weeks ago. And he died on Sat. He was eating when I got him but I didnt treat the water and I think the chlorine got to him. I thought I saw someone mention on some board somewhere that fantasys were weaker in some way but then I couldnt find reference to it again. I got a baby albino cranwelli at the show too and he is fine altho not eating as much as I want him to. Which also made me wonder if the cranwelli can "take more abuse" when it comes to care. I have an ornate I have had since last fall and he is doing fine (also with the untreated water up until this week).

I want to get another frog and really like the high horns on the fantasy and I also like the brighter colors. It seems that they do fade tho.

Thanks!
Carole

[BerserkApe]

Sadly, no real good photos. But, my fantasy started off green and brown,with a lime green W, and a white belly/throat. He had specks of maroon. Now, he's mostly black, green, and brown and a black speckled belly. He's lost the W but he's developing a water stain-like ring of tab along his sides.

[Pheathers]

Here's mine, "Boca". He's gone from bright green, to brown, to tan and green, back to green. Depends on if he's on paper towels or coconut fiber bedding. I've had him 2 years now! He doesn't eat much, but he's still pretty robust.

[Heatheranne]

Here's mine, "Boca". He's gone from bright green, to brown, to tan and green, back to green. Depends on if he's on paper towels or coconut fiber bedding. I've had him 2 years now! He doesn't eat much, but he's still pretty robust.

Still so pretty .

[Mentat]

...Here's mine, "Boca". He's gone from bright green, to brown, to tan and green, back to green. Depends on if he's on paper towels or coconut fiber bedding. I've had him 2 years now! He doesn't eat much, but he's still pretty robust.

Boca is a very nice Fantasy! Like the colors it shows on last pic, thanks for share !

[Nathan Tetzlaff]

I was also curious about the health of fantasy frogs, so I made a similar post several weeks back!

http://www.frogforum.net/pacman-frog...asy-frogs.html

The general consensus was that Fantasy Frogs seem to be as healthy as their non-hybrid counterparts, but there may be a few exceptions. Red Fantasy Frogs, for whatever the reason, seem to be rare. A few users have had red fantasy frogs die on them unexpectedly; there's not enough proof to say that it's due to a genetic defect or something like that, however. It could just be a few unlucky owners.

Fantasy Frogs are relatively new. I can't find the post right now, but I remember reading on this forum that someone didn't even start breeding them for resale until a few years back. Because Fantasy Frogs are relatively new, I'm sure much remains to be discovered about their health. The Pacman hobby seems pretty small in general, so I wouldn't be surprised if it takes quite a long time before we really know how well Fantasy Frogs fair in terms of life span and general health.




TLDR; Fantasy Frogs are presumably a hardy and healthy hybrid. I believe they're too young as a breed to be saying for sure that they're AS healthy as their two counterparts, but they are fairly healthy. If I knew someone were looking to get a Pacman Frog, and they were interested in the look of a Fantasy, I wouldn't caution them against getting one.

[mpmackenna]

Here's mine, "Boca". He's gone from bright green, to brown, to tan and green, back to green. Depends on if he's on paper towels or coconut fiber bedding. I've had him 2 years now! He doesn't eat much, but he's still pretty robust.

So the frog changes in color based on his surroundings? Is this well documented and predictable? If you have an adult Cranwelli and you want his color to change can you just move him from coconut fiber to unbleached paper towels and expect him to morph? If so, how long would that process take?

Just curious, don't plan on messing with my enclosure anytime soon.
Mike

[danfrog]

Mood, stress, surroundings and age change color from my experience so far.

[Nathan Tetzlaff]

So the frog changes in color based on his surroundings? Is this well documented and predictable?...

I've read that sellers at reptile shows will specifically put frogs on white paper towels to brighten their colors. The time it takes the frog to adjust his color seems to vary. I've seen some people say their frog will brighten in as little as a few hours. Certain morphs seem to not adjust their colors at all, however. My green Fantasy Frog seems to change very little. I've seen pictures of other frogs that change dramatically depending on what substrate they're kept on.

[danfrog]

Oh yeah. Diet has a possibility of lightening and darkening colors too from what I understand. This is strictly to do with samurai blue cranwellis and samurai pacman food. Just a possibility. Not entirely sure.

[danfrog]

Young Mojo.

Adult Mojo.

He has almost zero green anymore.

[Hypnotic]

It also seems to happen while they mature, they seem to drop the green behind the ears. If you look at the pictures from day one to today, you can see he still has his green, but it became alot darker, and I've always kept him on the same colour substrate. In particular, look at the green specs behind his cheeks.

[mpmackenna]

Wow, that is all pretty cool. I am looking forward to seeing how my frog grows and changes over the years. Thanks for all the information.

[Samalander]

Here's my frog from 2001 (when he was ~10 years old)



Sept. 2013


He has definitely 'ripened' and lost his green over the years, most notably the strip behind his ears.

[GrifTheGreat]

They mostly adjust according to their surrounding, mood, stress, illness, ect. Pacman Food does not do anything with their colors at all. Beta Carotine can brighten their yellow and orange coloration slightly, but thats about it.

They change to blend in, but go through varying changes until reaching their adult colors.

This is the same frog.

Night time colors.


Daytime colors.