New Colorado River Toads....(20!!!)

[Kurt]

It is totally illegal to collect them in New Mexico, and it is only legal to collect a handful in Arizona under a state fishing license and under no circumstances can they be brought out of the state - that is illegal. Not only is that a violation of the state laws of Arizona and New Mexico, but it is a federal offense under the Lacey Act. USFW would love his contact information.


You need to dose them as I said earlier - 50 mg per kg of toad weight (so at a guess I would say 1-5 mg per toad, depending on their weights). Dose them by dusting food items. You definitely don't want to dose much more than this and you certainly don't want to under dose them.

The problem with dusting is you run the risk of underdosing and producing drug resitance in the target parasite. The proper way to administer fenbendazole and metronidazole is orally and this can be done with a blunt-ended syringe, which you should be able to get from your vet. With both drugs there is a little bit of wiggle room in overdosing, so no worries unless you go nuts with dosing.

[Deku]

The problem with dusting is you run the risk of underdosing and producing drug resitance in the target parasite. The proper way to administer fenbendazole and metronidazole is orally and this can be done with a blunt-ended syringe, which you should be able to get from your vet. With both drugs there is a little bit of wiggle room in overdosing, so no worries unless you go nuts with dosing.

I was confused about the panacur when he mentioned it. Like what if he overdosed or underdosed? So it seems easier to do it by syringe.
Iam curious is there a way to treat for parasites with injections or something?

[Mordecai]

We like out toads fat! The river toads have done a 180 when it comes to eating dubias. They have adjusted very well to the gut loaded roaches and gobble them up as soon as they hit the ground. I think that after they became more acquainted with their surroundings and settled in, they feel much more comfortable eating.
The "hippies" (a tank with 6 extremely laid back toads) even line up when they see us walk by, anticipating the roach rainfall.





These guys are doing so great now, and we couldn't be happier!!!

[Diogo Juliao]

I'm so jealous! I love Bufo alvarius and you've got quite a nice group!
Really nice, congrats

[Mordecai]

Thank you so very much! I have fallen head over heels for these guys! They are such great entertainment, and I'm so happy they are all doing well. There are 9 more on their way here right now!!! I'm so excited!

[Diogo Juliao]

That's great! Too bad that here in Portugal we only have access to the more common species such as terrestris, melanostictus and stuff

Good luck with your beautys

[Jace]

I have to admit, I am rather jealous! I have tried to get out feelers on the possibility of getting a Colorado River toad into Canada and so far, I have been told rather blunty to give up. However, they said that about my Pyxies, too, and now I have three of them! I really love the last picture, of the two toads...the one on the left is such a cutie...I would pick that one for sure!! Sigh....

[Kurt]

I have one

[Jace]

Okay, so now I'm jealous of you too! Thanks a lot....sigh....

[Kurt]

I had two, the other died.

[John]

I have to admit, I am rather jealous! I have tried to get out feelers on the possibility of getting a Colorado River toad into Canada and so far, I have been told rather blunty to give up. However, they said that about my Pyxies, too, and now I have three of them! I really love the last picture, of the two toads...the one on the left is such a cutie...I would pick that one for sure!! Sigh....

If I were you I'd get a Rococco (spelling?) or a Marine toad instead - easier to come by, no drug implications, and Marines can become very tame (eating dog food out of a bowl for you).

[Jace]

I wonder what the availability is on them in Canada? From what I have read of Marine toads, they are poisonous and are a potential threat to native species, which means Canada may not let them across the border. Maybe I should start looking for a native toad species. I have yet to come across anything remotely amphibian in my own city yet I know they are out there.....a nice Canadian toad would suit me just fine! Thanks for the suggestions John.

[John]

I doubt Cane/Marine Toads (Bufo marinus) are illegal in Canada. They can't survive cold winters, so there's no danger there. Having said that, Canada's legislature aren't known for their good sense when it comes to amphibians - several provinces have banned some of the Phyllobates dart frogs because the are under the uninformed impression that these poisonous amphibians are poisonous in captivity - they are not - if they were, I'd be dead many times over.

[Greatballzofire]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canadian_Toad
http://www.env.gov.bc.ca/wld/frogwat...s/westtoad.htm
In BC you could go herping and find some western toads (Bufo boreas boreas). This toad is a close relative of the California toad (,Bufo boreas halophilus) the kind I have. Mine are great pets and don't get humongous, so are easy to house and feed.

[Morbidph8]

That's interesting. Well like I said before, I was under the assumption that they were captive bred until after I received them. It was after receiving them that I learned how they was collected. I never had a need to check on individual state laws as I assumed that he wouldn't do anything that was illegal just to sell some toads. I'll pass that info on to him just to make sure that he is aware of it in the event that he goes out to collect in the future. So far our guys are responding well to treatment. We are just a couple of days in and have fattened them up significantly. We have got them to adjust to the dubia nicely and hopefully they will take to the panacur as well. Thanks for the info John!

Hi ive been lurking for a while. It bugs me when people get wild caught Sonoran desert toads. While they may be found in CA, and NM. Most of the WC Colorado Toad come from Arizona. In AZ with a valid fishing license you can take a bag limit of certain wild amphibians. The law also states that AZ Native wildlife, cannot be sold, bought, or traded. They can only be given away. It's also against the law to take AZ Native wildlife outside of the state. Now Im not saying you guys did anything wrong. I live in AZ so it bugs me when I see kingsnake ads with sonorans for sale. Knowing they are illegaly been taken away from my state. Other than that. Your pics of your toads are great. Sonoran are one of my favorite toads. I currently have a Great Plaines toad I caught in my backyard. It's mansoon season now. Breeding season! Theres about 4 different toad species near me. I'm outside of the range for Sonorans though. I'm hoping I can find another Red Spotted Toad this year.

Sonoran Desert Toad (Incilius alvarius) - Amphibians of Arizona
Arizona Reptile/Amphibian Hunting Regulations
http://www.azgfd.gov/pdfs/h_f/regula...eAmphibian.pdf

[Jeff Kennedy]

We will be selling a small quantity of these in about a week. They have all been rehabilitated and treated for parasites. It has already cost us several hundred dollars in roaches and crickets to get these fella's back on track but it has been totally worth it. These are probably some of the most endearing frogs that I have ever owned. They act like dogs. It only took about a week for them to start recognizing me as a food source and now, every morning, they are lined up in front of there tanks waiting patiently for their turn to eat. We have (4) 20 gallon long tanks all in a row so you can imagine what this looks like. It is really going to be tough letting some of these guys go but we knew going in that we couldn't keep them all. So if you are interested, send me a PM and we can discuss the details. We are only releasing a select few at this time.

[Mordecai]

The "hippies" trying to line up.



The "hippies" perfecting the line up, and the "newbies",... well they try!

[Morbidph8]

Wow they sure look great. I would love a couple, that is if you can prove they where not poached from AZ. It would be illegal to pay for an AZ native of course. Oh wait you already stated they where illegally taken from AZ. So yea have fun in dealing with illegally taken wildlife. FYI anybody who buys these would be also be breaking the law. Better hope USFW doesn't come knocking at your door. I'm sorry if I'm being a douche but I'm not the one poaching wildlife from my state.

[Morbidph8]

To the user who gave me bad rep and said "Doesn't effect you, toads are not endangered, minding your own business might be a good idea." Yes it does effect me because as a citizen of AZ I have a obligation to stop the illegal taking of wildlife from my state. It's smucks like you who will make them endangered. Theres laws in place for a reason. Maybe you don't care about the law, but I do. BTW I'm forwarding this topic to Arizona Fish & Game. Ill let them deal with it. Have fun when your house is raided.

[Jeff Kennedy]

Alright, now let me get my rep hit a little bit. It's ok because I feel like this needs to be addressed.

(V)orbidPh8: "I'm sorry if I'm being a douche". Those were your words but I couldn't agree with you more. You're acting like an idiot. I think the entire situation has been made clear through this thread but since it hasn't sunk into your skull yet, let me spell it out for you again. You are probably just so deep into your law studies that you overlooked some things. I bought this large group of toads under the impression that they were captive bred. I was advised by the seller that he raised them himself from eggs. It was not until they showed up at my door, malnourished and parasite ridden that I discovered that the majority was raised from a strain of wild caught eggs that he had harvested. In a sense they are captive bred but I'm not going to argue that issue. The issue is that we bought a large lot because we like them and wanted to have several of them in our own collection. We wanted to allow them to grow and then keep the biggest ones for ourselves and sell off the others. Obviously we are in no position to take on (29) full grown toads. You can find these toads for sale quite often and a lot of the popular online vendors offer them only for a much higher price. Now if I was the one going in to AZ and "poaching" them like you say just to turn around and re-sale them, then I get that issue. I, however am not. As it stands right now I am probably just about breaking even on the toads. I have the original purchase price on them all (which wasn't cheap), a couple hundred in dubia roaches and crickets that was required to bulk them back up as well as vet bills on (3) of them because I couldn't find any local vets that would prescribe the drugs used to treat the toads for parasites without them being seen. The way I see it is had it not been for me, the original owner would have continued not being able to feed these guys and they all would have just withered away and died. Is that the fate that you think your native toads deserved since you care about them so much?? Try to open up your mind a little bit and see the bigger picture. That is that we did a good thing by rescuing these guys, rehabilitating them and giving them a good home. Now they are healthy and happy and well cared for. Who cares if we now have a couple healthy specimens that we can pass on to other hobbyists to enjoy? Go ahead and do whatever you feel is necessary. Forward this to whomever you want. I am so tired of keyboard bully's that still live with their parents, wanting to get online and screw with good people just because they have nothing better to do. Go back to lurking as you said in your first post because this community was better without you. As far as the negative mark on your rep, it wasn't me. I just did log on and see your ignorance firsthand for myself. Sorry to John, all the moderators, members etc. I don't plan on getting all grade school with this but I felt that I had the right to defend myself under such an attack. My apologies in advance.