New Member needs urgent advice for Dumpy Tree Frog

[Hop2It]

Hello Everyone! I just registered with the Frog Forum and have a concern with one of my Dumpy Tree Frogs. This past Summer I purchased 2 Tree Frogs, one male and one female. The female is doing great, however the male is not. For the first few months the male ate the super worms with no problem, and he would make a loud croaking sound at night. That has changed and now I'm really concerned. He has not eaten anything in over a month! I've tried the super worms, some smaller meal worms, and even a small month. He rejects all food. Also, instead of the loud croak, he will occasionally get out a few squeaks while opening and closing his mouth. Even though he seems to be getting smaller, there really are no outward appearances that he is ill. He seems to have good strength since he is mobile and still climbs. I am puzzled and not sure what to do next. I'm new to this and apologize if I missed a thread that already addressed this issue.

[wesleybrouwer]

Is anything changed in the tank?
If nothing seems wrong with him besides eating and croaking less i supose temperature dropped or/and humidity got down?

They tend to be less active during their resting period in nature,
same as the frogs outdoors, they are not at the same activity level year round.

If really nothing changed, try putting the temperature and humidity up and see how he does.
Usually after a good spraying they will be more active for a while.

Hopefully i'm right on this and nothing is wrong with him

[Hop2It]

Thanks for your quick response! I just checked and the humidity gauge is showing 50% and the Temp is around 78 degrees Fahrenheit. I'll try to increase the levels of both to see if that makes a difference. I'm really concerned that he is not eating and afraid that he will starve. Do Tree Frogs go into some sort of hibernation mode around this time of the year? Thanks again for your help!

[wesleybrouwer]

Hi,

the temperature is good, it should be between 25-28 Celcius,
that is 77-82,4 Fahrenheit i believe.

Humidity is somewhat low, it should be somewhere around 70%.
Altough they might withstand lower humidity levels as well.

Frogs in nature have breeding periods in wich they are more active,
they certainly call more during this periods.
Outside this periods they will be croaking less then when they feel like breeding.
That may be the problem, but looking at those values nothing is realy wrong with it.

If they don't eat for a night it is not that big of a deal,
but keep an eye on him.
If he doesn't get more active by raisin the levels you can let some fresh feces examine on any problems.
Altough i didn't hear you mentioning he is sitting in the water or anything,
my first guess would be that he got his resting period due to lower temps or humidity then usual.

[Hop2It]

Hi,

Thanks for the good advice. I just checked the humidity and noticed that it has now dropped below 50%. Do you have any advice for increasing the humidity level? I have a double bulb light on top of the cage along with a 75 watt heat lamp. Also, I have 2 good sized dishes with water in them. Both frogs do sit in the water or hang out on the waterfall that I have in the cage. Can Dumpy Tree Frogs go for long periods of time (weeks) without eating? Is this part of the resting period?

[jtay]

See thread 'Increaing humidity?' - there are loads of good ideas on how to increase humidity in that thread.

http://www.frogforum.net/vivarium-te...-humidity.html

[wesleybrouwer]

Hi,

i am not sure if it is day or night in you're place.
Here it is night

Tree frogs will be active during the night, so at daytime they always take a nap.
That is normal behaviour.

Not eating for weeks is not a good sign
I doubt if they survive.
You don't have to see it like a hibernation like bears do.

They do eat and move, but not as much as they used to do when around breeding season,
that is the time they become most active, calling and feeding.
Most frogs will do less when temperatures drop since their metabolism depends on external heat.

For bringing up the humidity, you can spray more often,
Most people around the US as i read do this by hand using a flower sprayer (right word?)
How much and how often depends on how well the humidity stays in you're tank.
Taping off some of the ventilation when it dries out to quick might help a bit.

Frogs sitting in or around the water all the time need to be checked upon closely,
it is no good sign in most cases.

[Hop2It]

Hi,

I have been reading the threads regarding humidity this evening. Since the bottom of the cage is covered about an inch high with Hydro Balls I thought that this, along with having a waterfall, would be all I needed to keep the humidity at a good level. I have never sprayed inside the cage. Both frogs do sit in their water dishes occasionally but not all the time. Do you think I should start spraying a mist inside the cage about 2 times a day? Do you think this could be a cause for the male tree frog not eating.

I was also checking out the medical section which described how to treat various ailments. I was particularly checking out the ones that dealt with frogs not eating. I was curious where this medicine could be purchased. Is this something that a pet supply store would carry? Thanks again for your advice!

[Ebony]

Hi there, Sorry I cant help you with where to purchase the medicines..my guess would be a vet but it wouldn't hurt checking at pet suppliers. In NZ we just about need a script for every thing...lol. I recommend misting. I also have a waterfall in my enclosure and still mist every day.

I read that you have been feeding them superworms..these are over sized mealworms right? I just thought I would mention that feeding too many mealworms can cause impaction. They should be feed as a treat food only. Not sure if that is the problem but popped into my head when reading this thread. I hope your frog starts eating again soon.

[wesleybrouwer]

Like ebony said , you can mist you're viv once or twice a.day to get the humidity at the wanted level .

My best guess would be getting the meds at a vet.
They can also help you calculate the dose, this will depend on bodymass .

I am not yet used to lot of the english names on most things like animals or feeders ,
But if ebony is right and those are oversized mealworms,
This could be a problem due to the tough exoskelleton.
But they would be spending more time in the water in my experience , it is also a cause to prolapses of the intestines.
Bathing the frog I Luke water may help in those cases.

But I would say, first try getting the rv up by misting.
If that does not help you look further .

[Hop2It]

The super worms might be causing the problem since they do have a hard outer shell. What are some other foods you recommend? Thanks

[Hop2It]

I did put the frog in lukewarm water one time. Maybe I'll continue this more frequently, along with misting, to see if that brings about any improvement.

[wesleybrouwer]

It MIGHT pose a problem to the frog,
feeding insects with a hard outershell can sometimes cause a prolapse.
It can also clog the intestines, but i am not sure that is the case here.
Sometimes my offspring die because they had to much insects with indigestible parts.
Others seem to do just fine with it, so i give them those insects, but not to much,

Best is to vary in the feeder insects you use,
for bigger frogs you got a good amount of feeders you can use.

Silkworms, waxmoths(sparsly since full of fat), crickets, little grasshoppers, tebo worms, larvaes of the black soldier fly and the flies itself etc,
If you live in a place where you have woods or something where you are certain of they don't use pesticides or fertilizers you could just catch yourself some bugs to feed,
be carefull tough not to get yourself poisonous insects like bees, wasps, certain spiders and so on.

Reading you're first post,
i think you will do best with just increasing humidity,
however variation in food is always good ofcourse.
You wrote he did not eat for a month,
i think he is less active and you just did not see him feed.\
They do this at night and i realy think he would be dead by now if he did not eat that long.
Try getting him active by spraying when the lights go off or just before that.
You can do probably more wrong then good by stressing him out.

Just be patient and try getting up the humidity a little.
I hope you understand they are nocturnal.

[wesleybrouwer]

I did put the frog in lukewarm water one time. Maybe I'll continue this more frequently, along with misting, to see if that brings about any improvement.

Sorry, i think you misunderstood what i told.
The luke water is a way to treat a frog that has his intestines clogged up because of indigestible parts he did not get out.
Or if they get it out but while doing so they get a prolapse in result, that is the same thing as hemmerrhoids with humans when you have to push to hard

Other then when certain of this, it has no use in putting him in the water.
Like i said, frogs with a problem will sit in the water very often.
Occasionaly sitting in the water is just normal, certainly if the RV is to low and you never mist the cage.
Frogs don't drink but get their water trough the skin.
You can see it as drinking as you wish.

Just start to spray your viv just before or just after the lights turn off.
I'll think this will do just fine.
Altough i start thinking he is active, but not when you are still awake.

[Hop2It]

Hello again....I tried putting my frog in warm water a few times this week just in case his intestines were clogged. He does not have a prolapse so I've stopped this procedure. If both frogs are gong, I have not seen any feces in the cage in a while.

I'm concentrating now on getting the humidity level higher in the cage. I've added water to the hydro balls and I have started misting the cage a few times a day. However, the humidity level still does not get above 50%. The temp seems fine as it stays between 70 and 80 degrees Fahrenheit.

As for feeding, I bought some fresh meal worms yesterday. Both frogs will not eat anything that I hold in front of them. They just bat at it with their front leg or flick it aside if the food is crawling beside them. That being the case I just put several meal worms in a shallow container for the night. This morning I couldn't tell if any had been eaten however a few did manage to crawl into the water dish and drown. Like you say, the smaller male frog probably would not be alive by now if it was not getting some sort of nutrition. To look at him you would not think that anything was wrong, but I'm still not 100% comfortable thinking that is the case. I would feel much better if I actually saw him eating something. Is it true that frogs will only eat live bugs, worms, etc? I'll keep you posted on any changes. I think I might try to upload a picture of the cage and a picture of each frog.

[bshmerlie]

Frogs will only eat the live moving insects. I would stick withcrickets at this point. As far as the humidity not going above 50%, check to make sure your gauge is working. Invest in a good digital gauge that way it is easier to see the fluctuations after you mist.

[Hop2It]

I'll go get some crickets tomorrow and give that a try. Can I just put a few in the cage and let the frogs catch them on their own, or should I feed them to the frogs using tweezers?

Yesterday I purchased a new gauge made by Flukers and will see if that gives me a different reading than the one that came with the cage. I saw the digital ones but opted not to get one due to the cost. But as you mentioned, that may be my best bet due to much better accuracy. I'm from Pennsylvania and when I purchased the frogs in July the house had more humidity, but now that it is Fall, the air is getting much drier. This is quite the challenge. Thanks for your advice.

[bshmerlie]

I wouldn't try feeding with tweezers until the are very settled in and eating great. I've given up on the cheap gauges. Preferably use a cricket dish or let the crickets roam free. Put then in 30 minutes after lights out.

[Hop2It]

I used to keep crickets in a cricket cage when I had a fire bellied toad, however I am not sure what a cricket dish is for frogs. Could you please let me know what that is. I can ask tomorrow at Pet Smart when I go to get crickets. At night do you turn all the lights off in the cage or do you leave one on that simulates moonlight? I have been leaving one light on at night that has sort of a blue glow.

[Jace]

A cricket dish is nothing fancy...most of us use an appropriate sized glass bowl (something the frog can fit in to get crickets but not overly huge) and sink it into the substrate. If you dump in the crickets at night, any crickets left over from the feeding usually end up in the glass bowl and are either easy pickings for your frogs or easy for you to remove and regutload for the next feeding. I picked up various sized glass bowls at the dollar store and use them both for water dishes and for cricket bowls.